SimSig :: Topic: New SimSig beginners' tutorial using Royston (8/9)

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TOPIC: New SimSig beginners' tutorial using Royston

Re: New SimSig beginners' tutorial using Royston 01 Feb 2012 21:34 #71

Noisynoel
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clive wrote:

maxand wrote:

did we ever establish whether it was acceptable (to the Driver) to instead set the route into the loop and expect the train to successfully reverse behind the signal in there as an alternative to 246?

Tom, thanks for suggesting an intriguing alternative for 6R02. However, I can't see how this can work as you describe it. I can't set a route into the loop from K977 to K253 without getting a "waiting for correct route to be set" message, so I need to abandon the timetable.

The timetable says reverse at K246, so the driver is complaining about being sent the wrong way.

To make matters worse, although I can set a route for it from K244 to Sherriff's Siding , on reversing into it it runs out of valid track. This is clearly illogical but understandable since the programmer intended the train to be reversed via K246.

There's some magic in there. If a train's timetable says "Sherriff's" and nothing else, it exits the simulation. Otherwise it finds itself sitting at the buffer stop. The real sidings consisted of a headshunt and some storage sidings, and this simulates the choice between using one or the other.

Also a driver will not query a route from a shunt signal in real life as it would vary rarely indicate which route is set from the signal, the driver would take the route, but observe the lie of the points.

The catch-22 is that (unlike another sim I've named before) we are not privy to block lengths, not even the length of the Down Loop,[/quote

Hmmm, just like real life then....

I'm pretty sure that if a signaller was faced with this situation in his local area he would be able to dig out a chart of block lengths so could reliably park a long train on a loop.

He would not recess a freight train unless it was booked to do so, therefore would be within the length limit of the siding, or instructed to do so by Control, who would have checked the length of the train beforehand.

Noisynoel (NOEL)

www.bwwmrc.co.uk/layouts/Horton/index.shtml

Last Edit: 01 Feb 2012 21:34 by Noisynoel.

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Re: New SimSig beginners' tutorial using Royston 01 Feb 2012 21:48 #72

Steamer OFFLINE Local Operations Manager Posts: 568 Thank you received: 161	Clive wrote: Those tables aren't mine; I don't know where they came from. I've written those. I thought the ones you wrote for the Euston manual were a good idea, so I'm in the process of writing them for all Simulations that have F11 in them. I'll upload a corrected version of the Royston Tables tommorrow.
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Re: New SimSig beginners' tutorial using Royston 01 Feb 2012 22:00 #73

ralphjwchadkirk OFFLINE Local Operations Manager Posts: 261 Thank you received: 57	Noisynoel wrote: He would not recess a freight train unless it was booked to do so, therefore would be within the length limit of the siding, or instructed to do so by Control, who would have checked the length of the train beforehand. No siggy I know would trust the planners or control to get their SLUs right. Too many times a train has been looped arse-end-out.
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Re: New SimSig beginners' tutorial using Royston 01 Feb 2012 22:46 #74

clive
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Steamer wrote:

I've written those. I thought the ones you wrote for the Euston manual were a good idea, so I'm in the process of writing them for all Simulations that have F11 in them. I'll upload a corrected version of the Royston Tables tommorrow.

Ah, fine. Note that the Euston ones only cover the complex area of the throat, not the rest of the layout.

When you update the Royston ones, please note that the 1xx signals should have a CA prefix (which they will on next refresh), not a C prefix.

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Re: New SimSig beginners' tutorial using Royston 01 Feb 2012 22:48 #75

clive OFFLINE Administrator Posts: 696 Thank you received: 188	[quote="JamesN" post=28623While Kings Cross has been corrected upon refresh, Royston remains the wrong way round[/quote] It may stay that way because it's an extract from the Cambridge simulation. Or it may get flipped; I haven't decided yet.
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Re: New SimSig beginners' tutorial using Royston 01 Feb 2012 23:57 #76

maxand
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Just caught up with the last three pages of posts which appeared since last night (our time). Whew!

Thank you all again for your forthright comments and particularly Clive for correcting me on a number of issues, and Peter Bennet, for that beautiful pic of entry and exit buttons (do you mind if I include that in the tutorial?). These make me feel that every sim needs its own detailed "manual behind the manual" to explain its hidden intricacies. Maybe this will happen one day. Not as long as the Royston tutorial, in which everything will be new to the newbie, but more detailed for those who might feel they need it.

I now understand the reason for having a LOS and putting it where it is. One thing still puzzles me. Why were all 4 freight trains chosen to be longer than the space between the LOS and K977? Would it not have been better to have included at least one in the official TT that fits in, and used it for, say, run-round manoeuvres? Otherwise newbies will be asking the same question. (Maybe I should have a go at writing a TT.)

Clive, I admired your comments about "magic", though it might deserve a mention in the fine print section of the next upgrade of the tutorial, otherwise newbies will see it as yet another manifestation of Arthur C. Clarke's third law: "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

Steamer:

Try scrolling down onto page 2 for K986. Yes, I've just noticed that I didn't put the second long route in K986's row, I'll correct that in due course.

Thanks. I didn't realize there was a tiny bit of the table spilling onto page 2 of the PDF.

I don't know what the developers' policy is regarding making route tables available for users, but it would be nice to see them available for all sims. I've seen others elsewhere (maybe thanks to Steamer for including them!) and I realize it means a lot of work compiling them, but they might save players a lot of time looking them up to confirm whether a route can be set between two signals.

On the subject of signalmen/women/persons, with all due respect to those (particularly Josie) who responded, I'll adhere to my original statement and use "signaller" throughout, to avoid raising this controversy in future.

Please keep your comments coming. I will add an update date to the title page after amendments are made.

If it's green or it wriggles, it's biology.
If it's smelly or explosive, it's chemistry.
If it doesn't work, it's because there's no route between selected signals.

Last Edit: 01 Feb 2012 23:58 by maxand.

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Re: New SimSig beginners' tutorial using Royston 02 Feb 2012 00:12 #77

postal
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maxand wrote:

One thing still puzzles me. Why were all 4 freight trains chosen to be longer than the space between the LOS and K977?

Because that is what happened on the day when the data for the TT was extracted. That is an instance where the simulation replicates real life rather than having a TT created for game play.

Just to clarify, many of the TT's which are created are based on a representation of a real-life day on the railway. They are not an attempt by the TT designer to give all of the features of the simulation a good work-out.

"Reading your own material aloud forces you to listen."

Stephen Ambrose, Historian, January 10, 1936 - October 13, 2002

Last Edit: 02 Feb 2012 00:14 by postal.

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Re: New SimSig beginners' tutorial using Royston 02 Feb 2012 05:01 #78

maxand OFFLINE Local Operations Manager Posts: 717 Thank you received: 42	Because that is what happened on the day when the data for the TT was extracted. That is an instance where the simulation replicates real life rather than having a TT created for game play. You evidently overlooked the statement in the manual that the freight trains are all imaginary.
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Re: New SimSig beginners' tutorial using Royston 02 Feb 2012 06:09 #79

clive
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postal wrote:

maxand wrote:

One thing still puzzles me. Why were all 4 freight trains chosen to be longer than the space between the LOS and K977?

Because that is what happened on the day when the data for the TT was extracted. That is an instance where the simulation replicates real life rather than having a TT created for game play.

Not in this case. I'd put all the effort into coding up the sidings and wanted them to get a least a little use. So I quickly put together a few trains to use them. But the idea wasn't to demonstrate every possible move.

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Re: New SimSig beginners' tutorial using Royston 02 Feb 2012 09:29 #80

postal OFFLINE Local Operations Manager Posts: 1677 Thank you received: 377	maxand wrote: Because that is what happened on the day when the data for the TT was extracted. That is an instance where the simulation replicates real life rather than having a TT created for game play. You evidently overlooked the statement in the manual that the freight trains are all imaginary. Clearly did overlook it. Apologies.
	"Reading your own material aloud forces you to listen." Stephen Ambrose, Historian, January 10, 1936 - October 13, 2002 The administrator has disabled public write access.