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Rugby Centre: More Northampton problems

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Rugby Centre: More Northampton problems 15/01/2018 at 22:29 #105119
Afterbrunel
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I'm not sure whether this is a timetable error or inherent in the sim. I am running the basic supplied timetable.

In demo 22 attached, 5W82 has been waiting in platform 1 at Northampton for some time. The much delayed 1W82 has finally arrived and coupled to it, correctly. 1W82 now asks for the road. The TRTS light is flashing, correctly. However the signal will not clear automatically even though 1W82 is in ARS mode. If you press "Query ARS Routesetting status" for 1W82, it responds "Waiting for joining train 5W82". In fact 5W82 has already disappeared, having been coupled to 1W82. It correctly does not appear in the train list F2.

At the same time 2Y57 is TRTS in the down direction, but will not leave, because 5Y00 is in front. 5Y00 is booked to depart at 08:38 (over an hour later) and is shown at the buffer stops. (Incidentally in F2, if several trains are in a platform road, there is no way to tell what sequence they are in, is there?

Anyway in demo22 I have just killed 5Y00 and 2Y57 will at last depart. I hate killing trains, and I don't know how I could have avoided getting into this situation.

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Rugby Centre: More Northampton problems 15/01/2018 at 22:37 #105120
GeoffM
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Afterbrunel in post 105119 said:
Anyway in demo22 I have just killed 5Y00 and 2Y57 will at last depart. I hate killing trains, and I don't know how I could have avoided getting into this situation.
One would think that setting a route manually would be better than "killing" a train.

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Last edited: 15/01/2018 at 22:56 by GeoffM
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Rugby Centre: More Northampton problems 15/01/2018 at 23:16 #105121
headshot119
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Afterbrunel in post 105119 said:
I'm not sure whether this is a timetable error or inherent in the sim. I am running the basic supplied timetable.

In demo 22 attached, 5W82 has been waiting in platform 1 at Northampton for some time. The much delayed 1W82 has finally arrived and coupled to it, correctly. 1W82 now asks for the road. The TRTS light is flashing, correctly. However the signal will not clear automatically even though 1W82 is in ARS mode. If you press "Query ARS Routesetting status" for 1W82, it responds "Waiting for joining train 5W82". In fact 5W82 has already disappeared, having been coupled to 1W82. It correctly does not appear in the train list F2.
ARS is not perfect, and sometimes requires manual intervention, another option is to make the train None-ARS then put it back into ARS mode.

Afterbrunel in post 105119 said:

At the same time 2Y57 is TRTS in the down direction, but will not leave, because 5Y00 is in front. 5Y00 is booked to depart at 08:38 (over an hour later) and is shown at the buffer stops. (Incidentally in F2, if several trains are in a platform road, there is no way to tell what sequence they are in, is there?

Anyway in demo22 I have just killed 5Y00 and 2Y57 will at last depart. I hate killing trains, and I don't know how I could have avoided getting into this situation.
There's a slight bug in the midnight timetable that means the train divides the wrong way round. Please press check for updates to get the new version.

"Platform 1 your Maesteg service. Platform 1A your Aberdare. Platform 2 your London!"
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Rugby Centre: More Northampton problems 16/01/2018 at 07:07 #105123
Afterbrunel
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"One would think that setting a route manually would be better than "killing" a train."

Well, as I said, 5Y00 is shown in front of 2Y57. 2Y57 needs to depart now, and 5Y00 isn't going to move for another hour or more. I'm not quite sure what you are suggesting as a solution here?

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Rugby Centre: More Northampton problems 16/01/2018 at 07:26 #105124
JamesN
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Afterbrunel in post 105123 said:
"One would think that setting a route manually would be better than "killing" a train."

Well, as I said, 5Y00 is shown in front of 2Y57. 2Y57 needs to depart now, and 5Y00 isn't going to move for another hour or more. I'm not quite sure what you are suggesting as a solution here?
Run 5Y00 as 2Y57 and vice versa, abandon TT for 5Y00 and move it to the GL, let 2Y57 depart then put it back in Bay and reinstate TT.

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Rugby Centre: More Northampton problems 16/01/2018 at 09:57 #105128
postal
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Afterbrunel in post 105123 said:
"One would think that setting a route manually would be better than "killing" a train."

Well, as I said, 5Y00 is shown in front of 2Y57. 2Y57 needs to depart now, and 5Y00 isn't going to move for another hour or more. I'm not quite sure what you are suggesting as a solution here?
Using your initiative which is one of the key attributes you need to be a signaller.

"Many a man can save himself if he admits he's done wrong and takes his punishment." - Henrik Ibsen, Swedish playwright, 03/08/1829 - 05/11/1907
Last edited: 16/01/2018 at 09:58 by postal
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Rugby Centre: More Northampton problems 16/01/2018 at 10:39 #105130
norman B
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In the RW it would involve other departments to be party to the problem and not just the signaller!!!

As it is just a simulation you can just do what is needed in order to get things running.

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Rugby Centre: More Northampton problems 16/01/2018 at 11:04 #105131
Afterbrunel
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1W82 is still refusing to call the route even though ARS enabled, at Hanslope ... it is still saying "Waiting for joining train 5W82".

Does anyone know how to edit the ARS rules fro individual trains?

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Rugby Centre: More Northampton problems 16/01/2018 at 11:09 #105133
headshot119
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Afterbrunel in post 105131 said:
1W82 is still refusing to call the route even though ARS enabled, at Hanslope ... it is still saying "Waiting for joining train 5W82".

Does anyone know how to edit the ARS rules fro individual trains?
I posted up the page "ARS is not perfect, and sometimes requires manual intervention, another option is to make the train None-ARS then put it back into ARS mode."

"Platform 1 your Maesteg service. Platform 1A your Aberdare. Platform 2 your London!"
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Rugby Centre: More Northampton problems 16/01/2018 at 11:27 #105137
MarkC
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Afterbrunel in post 105131 said:
1W82 is still refusing to call the route even though ARS enabled, at Hanslope ... it is still saying "Waiting for joining train 5W82".

Does anyone know how to edit the ARS rules fro individual trains?
I know its not perfect, but a solution to this is once you have signalled the train and it has passed the signal right click the TD and select "Make train ARS" and ARS should go back to normal.

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Rugby Centre: More Northampton problems 16/01/2018 at 21:41 #105155
Afterbrunel
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Thank you Headshot119 and MarkC.

Yes, ARS is not perfect and this is understandable in the situation when trains are running seriously out of course and the rules are inappropriate. But that isn't the case I referred to. 1W82 is ARS but will not call the route supposedly because it is waiting for a joining train, even though it is in plain line miles from the joining point. No junctions, no conflicts.

Of course you can work around this by setting the route manually, but nevertheless this is a serious problem in the precedence rules.

I am now running just after 08:00 and 1W86 has coupled to 5W86 and just left Northampton towards London. It won't call HN5304 for the same reason. Of course I can clear it manually, but I need to remember to do it when it gets to Hanslope because it will otherwise wait at HN5284, and, frankly I may not be looking at that part of the screen.

MarkC putting it in and out of ARS doesn't affect this at all.

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Rugby Centre: More Northampton problems 16/01/2018 at 21:53 #105157
MarkC
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Afterbrunel in post 105155 said:
Thank you Headshot119 and MarkC.

Yes, ARS is not perfect and this is understandable in the situation when trains are running seriously out of course and the rules are inappropriate. But that isn't the case I referred to. 1W82 is ARS but will not call the route supposedly because it is waiting for a joining train, even though it is in plain line miles from the joining point. No junctions, no conflicts.

Of course you can work around this by setting the route manually, but nevertheless this is a serious problem in the precedence rules.

I am now running just after 08:00 and 1W86 has coupled to 5W86 and just left Northampton towards London. It won't call HN5304 for the same reason. Of course I can clear it manually, but I need to remember to do it when it gets to Hanslope because it will otherwise wait at HN5284, and, frankly I may not be looking at that part of the screen.

MarkC putting it in and out of ARS doesn't affect this at all.
My suggestion was to set the route then when the TD passes the signal Click make ARS and it should work.

Take for example train in Northampton P1 train in status says waiting for joining train, but you have had the join compleate set the route from signal RY1024 to signal HN5306, once the TD is at HN5306 right click the TD and it should sort out the ARS, for that train. I have just ran a few mins on your save and it works for me.

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