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Hints & tips

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Hints & tips 23/04/2014 at 06:38 #59369
Late Turn
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Most of the ones that cross fast to slow south of Welwyn in the Down direction seem to be semi-fasts, running fast line to get ahead of a stopper but then needing to cross over to call at Potters Bar, Hatfield and Welwyn G.C. whilst allowing fast trains to pass. The same happens in reverse on the Up, and a few do the same, for the same reason, further north too. I find a sticky note helpful in that situation, with the headcode of the train booked to cross, and possibly the headcode of the previous one going straight along the fast too, as a reminder to pull the auto button out before it's too late!
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Hints & tips 23/04/2014 at 13:32 #59400
MrBitsy
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I did the early meal shift this morning at West Hampstead. Worked WestCad workstation from 8-9am, panel 4 9-10am, panel 3 10-11am then panel 2 11am-12pm. Our rosta never sees us work the same panel from one day to the next.
TVSC Link 4 signaller - Temple Meads, Bath & Stoke Gifford
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Hints & tips 23/04/2014 at 13:49 #59403
maxand
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@MrBitsy: That's excellent as it keeps refreshing your familiarity with each panel in turn. At least you stay within the West Hampstead area.
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Hints & tips 23/04/2014 at 22:53 #59428
BarryM
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2158 posts
If he needs refreshing, he would not be entertained at West Hampstead!
Barry, Sydney, New South Wales, Australia
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Hints & tips 24/04/2014 at 08:06 #59438
maxand
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I think you know what I really meant here.
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Hints & tips 01/05/2014 at 12:57 #59894
maxand
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It just didn't occur to me till now that the text in a shunter's phone call can be highlighted, copied (Ctrl+C) and pasted into a sticky note (or any other text file) like this:




Maybe it's because we can't just highlight and copy things like a train's timetable in the Show Timetable window. But at least this is a breakthrough and allows us to display the full TT by clicking the blue underlined link without having to look it up in the Timetable List, Simplifier, etc.

This is particularly helpful to me as my laptop PC manages to truncate the RH margin of the text on these calls. HTH.

(added)
NOTE:
1) To copy all the text as in the above example, the familiar Ctrl+A (Copy All) shortcut doesn't work. You have to move the cursor to the top left corner of the text window, then drag it all the way down to the bottom to highlight all the text, before pressing Ctrl+C.

2) This technique works in other useful places in SimSig. If the only source of a timetable author's notes for that TT happens to be in the Timetable Description window of the General tab in Timetable List window (e.g., the "Exeter Summer" Saturday and Sunday TTs, you can copy the text then paste it into an ordinary readme.txt file so that you don't need to install the timetable before you can read the notes!

Last edited: 02/05/2014 at 09:30 by maxand
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Hints & tips 15/06/2014 at 14:16 #61680
maxand
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Here are three more hints and tips, aimed at less experienced players (like me) playing an entirely new timetable:

1) Assume the TT is full of errors, confusing timing points and deliberate traps, even if it is by a supposedly reputable TT writer and is supposed to have been thoroughly play tested beforehand. Assume it will prove much more confusing than you initially thought (because it probably will!). Just because you have played a previous TT on the same sim does not mean this new TT will be straightforward. Forewarned is forearmed. It will force you to improve your skill set for dealing with problems as they appear. Don't thank the TT writer unless your first run happens to be totally smooth.

2) On your first run, forget about trying to keep to the timetable and instead concentrate on getting the sequence of trains right. Don't worry if you're an hour or more behind schedule, just aim to get the trains where they need to go and be content with this. This includes planning ahead for trains that must join. Don't hesitate to run the sim at two-thirds or even half speed. Don't make playing SimSig a stress ordeal; remember, if you're running two or more panels, you're actually being asked to do the job of two or more people. Just relax and pretend instead that you're playing with model trains, where timing schedules are unimportant and only the sequence of trains matters.

3) Discover how much you can get done while the sim is paused. Don't do any more than you absolutely need to while the sim is running, and you will surprise yourself by how much better the sim will run when you resume. You can edit timetables, locate mystery trains that will need to join those currently in your area, write sticky notes to yourself, check (but not answer) incoming telephone messages and generally troubleshoot ahead. You don't need to do any of this while the sim is running.

Good luck.

(slightly edited)

Last edited: 15/06/2014 at 14:28 by maxand
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Hints & tips 15/06/2014 at 14:18 #61681
headshot119
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" said:
Here are three more hints and tips, aimed at less experienced players (like me) playing an entirely new timetable:

1) Assume the TT is full of errors and confusing timing points, even if it is by a supposedly reputable TT writer and is supposed to have been thoroughly play tested beforehand. Assume it will prove much more confusing than you initially thought (because it probably will!). Just because you have played a previous TT on the same sim does not mean this new TT is straightforward. Forewarned is forearmed. It will force you to improve your skill set for dealing with problems as they appear. Don't thank the TT writer unless your first run happens to be totally smooth.

2) On your first run, forget about trying to keep to the timetable and instead concentrate on getting the sequence of trains right. Don't worry if you're an hour or more behind schedule, just aim to get the trains where they need to go and be content with this. This includes planning ahead for trains that must join. Don't hesitate to run the sim at two-thirds or even half speed. Don't make playing SimSig a stress ordeal; remember, if you're running two or more panels, you're actually being asked to do the job of two or more people. Just relax and pretend instead that you're playing with model trains, where timing schedules are unimportant and only the sequence of trains matters.

3) Discover how much you can get done while the sim is paused. Don't do any more than you absolutely need to while the sim is running, and you will surprise yourself by how much better the sim will run when you resume. You can edit timetables, locate mystery trains that will need to join those currently in your area, write sticky notes to yourself and check (but not answer) incoming telephone messages, and generally troubleshoot ahead. You don't need to do any of this while the sim is running.

Good luck.
4)

Always assume anything posted by Maxand will get peoples backs up within the first paragraph or two and result in about six hundred posts following it expressing peoples outrage.

"Passengers for New Lane, should be seated in the rear coach of the train " - Opinions are my own and not those of my employer
Last edited: 15/06/2014 at 14:19 by headshot119
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Hints & tips 15/06/2014 at 14:26 #61682
maxand
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headshot119 opined:
Quote:
Always assume anything posted by Maxand will get peoples backs up within the first paragraph or two and result in about six hundred posts following it expressing peoples outrage.
I know you to be so much more advanced than the people to whom my advice was directed that I doubt you'd have any understanding of this from their point of view.

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Hints & tips 15/06/2014 at 14:30 #61683
Noisynoel
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" said:
Here are three more hints and tips, aimed at less experienced players (like me) playing an entirely new timetable:

1) Assume the TT is full of errors, confusing timing points and deliberate traps, even if it is by a supposedly reputable TT writer and is supposed to have been thoroughly play tested beforehand. Assume it will prove much more confusing than you initially thought (because it probably will!). Just because you have played a previous TT on the same sim does not mean this new TT will be straightforward. Forewarned is forearmed. It will force you to improve your skill set for dealing with problems as they appear. Don't thank the TT writer unless your first run happens to be totally smooth.
Really! If you run the timetable analyser (Available via the F4 menu) then you will see any errors or warnings appertaining to the timetable. If the timing points are confusing then try learning the sims geography first!
If your not thanking the TT writer does that mean your not going to thank the sim developer if you find a signal 1 space to the left of where you think it should be, or even SIMSIG itself because you think it's not as easy to run a sim because it doesn't have a feature you want?

For pitys sake grow up!

Noisynoel
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Hints & tips 15/06/2014 at 14:47 #61684
Steamer
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" said:
1) Assume the TT is full of errors, confusing timing points and deliberate traps, even if it is by a supposedly reputable TT writer and is supposed to have been thoroughly play tested beforehand. Assume it will prove much more confusing than you initially thought (because it probably will!). Just because you have played a previous TT on the same sim does not mean this new TT will be straightforward. Forewarned is forearmed. It will force you to improve your skill set for dealing with problems as they appear. Don't thank the TT writer unless your first run happens to be totally smooth.
'User error' and 'timetable error' are two different things.

Quote:
2) On your first run, forget about trying to keep to the timetable and instead concentrate on getting the sequence of trains right. Don't worry if you're an hour or more behind schedule, just aim to get the trains where they need to go and be content with this. This includes planning ahead for trains that must join. Don't hesitate to run the sim at two-thirds or even half speed. Don't make playing SimSig a stress ordeal; remember, if you're running two or more panels, you're actually being asked to do the job of two or more people. Just relax and pretend instead that you're playing with model trains, where timing schedules are unimportant and only the sequence of trains matters.
Any newcomers reading this: DO NOT FOLLOW THE ADVICE ABOVE. Aim to keep trains reasonably on time. If you have trains running an hour or more late, you'll end up with trains waiting for joins blocking platforms etc. and the TT will become much more difficult than it actually is. A few minutes here or there is fair enough, but severely delayed trains are going to cause problems. If you find this happening often, you might want to get some more experience on the smaller simulations or an easier timetable.

"Don't stress/ relax/ let life roll off your backs./ Except for death and paying taxes/ everything in life.../ is only for now." (Avenue Q)
Last edited: 15/06/2014 at 14:52 by Steamer
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Hints & tips 15/06/2014 at 15:03 #61685
maxand
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Quote:
If you run the timetable analyser (Available via the F4 menu) then you will see any errors or warnings appertaining to the timetable.
Isn't it the TT writer's responsibility to run the TT analyser and correct any errors or warnings before unleashing the TT on us? Frankly, I hadn't even noticed the TT analyser till you mentioned it just now, as it is buried deep in the TT module under Tools 1.

Even when I finally unearthed it, it did not help me very much. But thanks anyway for drawing it to my attention.

Quote:
If the timing points are confusing then try learning the sims geography first!
Easy for you to say that. I think I have a pretty good idea of the general geography of the sims I play, but still get thrown by an undocumented timing point. Furthermore, it's not always easy for me to determine whether north or south correlates to Up or Down, likewise east and west, as branch lines may parallel main lines but be reverse in Up/Down orientation. The best I can do in the presence of poor documentation is save the game, make an educated guess and then try to find out why it doesn't work as planned.

Quote:
If your not thanking the TT writer does that mean your not going to thank the sim developer if you find a signal 1 space to the left of where you think it should be, or even SIMSIG itself because you think it's not as easy to run a sim because it doesn't have a feature you want?
You're the only one who's extrapolating here, not me. I actually have great admiration for anyone with enough spare time to create a sim or write a timetable. But I reserve my thanks for those who are able to view their work through a novice's eye.

If Samuel Johnson were alive today and playing SimSig he might have said "Sir, a simulation (or for that matter, a timetable) is like a dog's walking on his hind legs. It is not done well; but you are surprised to find it done at all."

As for Steamer's advice, all I can say is, try it my way too, then see which works better for you. My earlier comments were sincere.

Last edited: 15/06/2014 at 15:06 by maxand
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Hints & tips 15/06/2014 at 15:28 #61686
sloppyjag
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" said:
But I reserve my thanks for those who are able to view their work through a novice's eye.
So, the message here is that timetable writers should only be writing timetables suitable for novices rather than producing timetables that present a greater challenge to the more experienced user?

Planotransitophobic!
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Hints & tips 15/06/2014 at 15:54 #61688
Steamer
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" said:
As for Steamer's advice, all I can say is, try it my way too, then see which works better for you. My earlier comments were sincere.
I agree that the sequence of moves is important. However, having trains running several hours late will only cause problems due to unexpected conflicts and trains sat waiting for joins or access to a single line section. I can assure you that if everything is on time the simulation is far easier to play. This is especially true for timetables set before the millennium, with locos moving between trains.

"Don't stress/ relax/ let life roll off your backs./ Except for death and paying taxes/ everything in life.../ is only for now." (Avenue Q)
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Hints & tips 15/06/2014 at 16:39 #61689
Muzer
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To be fair on maxand, and about the only point I agree with, I have seen a lot of timetables with really annoying issues. Not necessarily the timetable writers' faults - maybe the sim was changed at some point and it's now slightly incompatible, or maybe it's something impossible to do in the sim so it's hacked on. The only sim I've played recently where such bugs have really frustrated me as opposed to just being a minor irritation is NLL - I've done about 5 "remove trains" in my current run on that because I can't be bothered to deal with the many timetable bugs/figure out what they are supposed to be, which is certainly a record for me
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Hints & tips 15/06/2014 at 19:35 #61695
LucasLCC
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" said:
1) Assume the TT is full of errors, confusing timing points and deliberate traps, even if it is by a supposedly reputable TT writer and is supposed to have been thoroughly play tested beforehand. Assume it will prove much more confusing than you initially thought (because it probably will!). Just because you have played a previous TT on the same sim does not mean this new TT will be straightforward. Forewarned is forearmed. It will force you to improve your skill set for dealing with problems as they appear. Don't thank the TT writer unless your first run happens to be totally smooth.
Maxand, whilst I've decided not to comment on posts of yours that I've disagreed with in the past, this time I feel that it is needed. Those that write timetables often do so with use from Working Timetables, Station Working Books, Train Departure Books and the like. The data that these gives is taken and put into the sim in a way the sim accepts. This some times means that unusual timing points are used. Not because the timetable writer was feeling mean, and not because they wanted to cause confusion to Maxand.

The fact that you assume all timetables are full of errors and designed to be confusing absolutely appalls me. Timetable writers do their best with what they are given. Something you seem to be incapable of given the constant moaning about sticky notes and other simulation features.

I'm working on several timetables myself, and one currently has nearly 100 errors and 650 warnings. I won't be releasing it with these errors, as I've been steadily removing them. But I am currently asking myself if I should actually bother. Because your conclusion is that it will be full of errors regardless.

Lastly, whilst I don't expect a round of applause or thanks for the timetable. I would not expect criticism for what I've been trying my best on. Especially as I don't do it for any personal gain.


" said:
3) Discover how much you can get done while the sim is paused. Don't do any more than you absolutely need to while the sim is running, and you will surprise yourself by how much better the sim will run when you resume. You can edit timetables, locate mystery trains that will need to join those currently in your area, write sticky notes to yourself, check (but not answer) incoming telephone messages and generally troubleshoot ahead. You don't need to do any of this while the sim is running.
Perhaps you should pause the Sim and make a sticky note detailing how criticising those that write timetables is not appreciated by the vast majority of those that use SimSig.

Last edited: 15/06/2014 at 20:24 by LucasLCC
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Hints & tips 15/06/2014 at 21:28 #61703
Hooverman
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My heart goes out to the SImSig timetable writers as even using the correct official timetable information will lead to errors that can't be helped, as some of these errors exist in the real world and we just have to get on with it. Virtually all of last weeks simplifies at work had missing trains or wrong destinations for the 1st 40 mins after midnight, we at least have the luxury of the radio and are able to contact the drivers and ask or have drivers stop at the signal and question the route. But when a timetable writer for SimSig uses that very same missing information they can only make the very best guess assumptions and I think they make a bloody good effort myself. Well done to all timetable writers for SimSig as these sims wouldn't be half as good without your efforts.

I honestly can't work out how someone who has played SimSig for as long as Max and still can't work things out, I suppose that everyone has different learning levels and some way slower than others. Maybe I'm being unfair with Max as I've been a signalman/ler for nearly 25yrs now and problem solving within SimSig is second nature to me. In real life when I went from my small one man signalbox with 14 trains per hour max to the the ASC where I now work which had 86 trains per hour off peak, I had to learn the routes, the simplifies (including all the errors that we got in them every timetable change) and how the various panels work pretty dam quick as it was all on a live railway without the luxury of a pause button!

But just to re-cap well done to all tt writers for making playing the sims as fun and sometimes as challenging as it is.

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Hints & tips 15/06/2014 at 21:41 #61704
Steamer
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Please can we have an opinion from the moderators on this?

It's frustrating that, yet again, we have TT writers being slated (without any suspected errors actually being produced for examination) and nothing being said. Obviously bug reports and constructive criticism is welcome and good, but the above is neither and makes the thread go down the personal route, without anything being gained or improved by the end of it. From my experience, timetables written by the community are to a very high standard and (while not absolutely perfect- but then what is?) generally error-free.

"Don't stress/ relax/ let life roll off your backs./ Except for death and paying taxes/ everything in life.../ is only for now." (Avenue Q)
Last edited: 15/06/2014 at 21:43 by Steamer
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Hints & tips 15/06/2014 at 21:58 #61705
Peter Bennet
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I've deleted the last 10 or so postings following complaints and because they add nothing to reasoned debate. They are not permanently deleted and might be restored in some form once we have considered the matter.

In the meantime I suggest if anyone identifies specific error in specific timetables/sims then raise them individually with evidence rather than as a general accusation.

Peter

I identify as half man half biscuit - crumbs!
Last edited: 15/06/2014 at 22:01 by Peter Bennet
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