New SimSig beginners' tutorial using Royston

Are you correct in saying that the R in 6R02 stands for it telling us that it reverses somewhere along the way and also that the T in 6T41 stands for a through train.

The problems newbies face are not only that there is a vastly greater amount of information to assimilate than they ever dreamed of, there are illogicalities lurking under the surface of every sim like dead trees under the surface of a lake, waiting to take you out when you inevitably run across them.

even a trifle dishonest in the way it claimed long freight trains could not fit behind the LOS (LK246) shunt signal, as I disproved.

That set me wondering. If that's the case, why does the sim need it, particularly if its freight trains are fictitious anyway? So far I haven't encountered any other train that uses it,

and anyway it's impossible to set a route from K978 to it, so I can't see Up Main trains using it.

Moral: Again it proves that that, in order to reverse, one must set a route past the reversing signal. Don't try to do the obvious and set a route from K978 or K980 to the LOS (Limit Of Shunt) signal LK246 - you'll either get “No route between selected signals” or “No overlap available”. Still at a LOS (so to speak) to know why they plonked LK246 there in the first place, if it's too short for freight trains? Me too. Let's try again

There might be no physical junctions, but some form of route indication will be given to a Driver approaching, for example, 977 signal, which has two main routes from it (plus various shunt and calling-on routes which will probably have their own route indication - most likely a small alpha-numeric indicator or set of stencils).

That set me wondering. If that's the case, why does the sim need it, particularly if its freight trains are fictitious anyway? So far I haven't encountered any other train that uses it.

Quote:

did we ever establish whether it was acceptable (to the Driver) to instead set the route into the loop and expect the train to successfully reverse behind the signal in there as an alternative to 246?

Tom, thanks for suggesting an intriguing alternative for 6R02. However, I can't see how this can work as you describe it. I can't set a route into the loop from K977 to K253 without getting a "waiting for correct route to be set" message, so I need to abandon the timetable.

To make matters worse, although I can set a route for it from K244 to Sherriff's Siding , on reversing into it it runs out of valid track. This is clearly illogical but understandable since the programmer intended the train to be reversed via K246.

If, as Steamer suggests, somebody wanted to write a historical TT for Royston using freight trains, they would have to be mighty short to fit into the down loop. :)

The catch-22 is that (unlike another sim I've named before) we are not privy to block lengths, not even the length of the Down Loop,

I'm pretty sure that if a signaller was faced with this situation in his local area he would be able to dig out a chart of block lengths so could reliably park a long train on a loop.

What does he know or care about Route Tables? The only one I've seen provided so far is Royston's, and even that's inaccurate as K986 is left out of the first column, so there's no mention of the second "long route" (which was inaccurately described in the manual - I've corrected it). He shouldn't have to resort to them - that's programmers' stuff.

I still don't understand your explanation of NX panels. Are you referring to ARS here?
Are these Entrance and Exit buttons terms used in SimSig, or are they the product of a different manufacturer?

However, if what you said is absolutely true, why didn't Royston's programmer add a bit of code to (a) prevent a train from reversing past the LOS, and (b) popping up a stern message to that effect? The fact that I was actually able to do it makes it SimSig's fault, not mine.

On the subject of what can be done and what should not be done, the overwhelming impression I got from SimSig's forum and Wiki when I sat down to write this tutorial was that the only thing that matters to the software is that a train passes its waypoints (is there a railway-specific term for this?) assigned to it in its TT, in the correct order. How[/i] it gets to these waypoints is up to the signaller.Quote:

That, roughly, is how the train simulation module works, yes.

[quote]Therefore the newbie should not feel he is doing anything wrong by signalling the driver to carry out manoeuvres even as unorthodox as reverse shunting past a LOS. It might not be the [i]recommended way, but it gets him home and boosts his confidence!

See previous message: there's a line between "possible" and "allowed" and we don't usually police the gap.

[quote]SimSig is proud of its claim to be as authentic as possible, yet still permits things like this to happen. You can't have it both ways

I hadn't realized until I saw it written down here that a British "siding", unlike an American one, doesn't allow trains out the far end.

It might seem like unnecessary pandering but I would tend to resent being referred to as a signalman. I know some heritage railways will only use 'signalman' because that's the historically-accurate job title, but that's because - historically - women didn't work on the railways.

On the real Kings Cross Panel the lines will be drawn exactly as on SimSig.

" said:

It might seem like unnecessary pandering but I would tend to resent being referred to as a signalman. I know some heritage railways will only use 'signalman' because that's the historically-accurate job title, but that's because - historically - women didn't work on the railways.

Actually, it's not historically accurate. There were signalwomen on the railways at least as far back as World War 2, and that was their job title.

There are 3 basic interfaces for signal route setting.

1 levers
2 By Operating a switch (One Switch Control)
3 Entrance Exit Panels (NX)

Looking at Google Earth, the Down Loop looks to be about 200m in length, so quite short. The sidings that remain there now are equally short though, so unless these sidings have been shortened in recent years - perhaps it's the virtual train that's too long in Simsig?

Are you back working on the Railways then?

" said:

On the real Kings Cross Panel the lines will be drawn exactly as on SimSig.

Not quite: it's the other way up!

" said:

It might seem like unnecessary pandering but I would tend to resent being referred to as a signalman. I know some heritage railways will only use 'signalman' because that's the historically-accurate job title, but that's because - historically - women didn't work on the railways.

Actually, it's not historically accurate. There were signalwomen on the railways at least as far back as World War 2, and that was their job title.

" said:

" said:

On the real Kings Cross Panel the lines will be drawn exactly as on SimSig.

Not quite: it's the other way up!

Hm, I thought the original release of King's Cross was the wrong way round compared to the panel, and in a subsequent release, the whole area was flipped around, so it is now matching the panel. Or are you referring to something else?

" said:

Quote:

did we ever establish whether it was acceptable (to the Driver) to instead set the route into the loop and expect the train to successfully reverse behind the signal in there as an alternative to 246?

Tom, thanks for suggesting an intriguing alternative for 6R02. However, I can't see how this can work as you describe it. I can't set a route into the loop from K977 to K253 without getting a "waiting for correct route to be set" message, so I need to abandon the timetable.

The timetable says reverse at K246, so the driver is complaining about being sent the wrong way.

Quote:

To make matters worse, although I can set a route for it from K244 to Sherriff's Siding , on reversing into it it runs out of valid track. This is clearly illogical but understandable since the programmer intended the train to be reversed via K246.

There's some magic in there. If a train's timetable says "Sherriff's" and nothing else, it exits the simulation. Otherwise it finds itself sitting at the buffer stop. The real sidings consisted of a headshunt and some storage sidings, and this simulates the choice between using one or the other.

The catch-22 is that (unlike another sim I've named before) we are not privy to block lengths, not even the length of the Down Loop,[/quote

Hmmm, just like real life then....

[quote]I'm pretty sure that if a signaller was faced with this situation in his local area he would be able to dig out a chart of block lengths so could reliably park a long train on a loop.

Those tables aren't mine; I don't know where they came from.

He would not recess a freight train unless it was booked to do so, therefore would be within the length limit of the siding, or instructed to do so by Control, who would have checked the length of the train beforehand.

I've written those. I thought the ones you wrote for the Euston manual were a good idea, so I'm in the process of writing them for all Simulations that have F11 in them. I'll upload a corrected version of the Royston Tables tommorrow.