Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop

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Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop 26/06/2014 at 14:08 #62089
maxand
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1637 posts 		2F30 (Paignton to Exmouth) is supposed to have arrived at Exmouth and change to its next service, which is 2E42, but the Train List shows it to be still facing Dn and "At buffer stop".

To add to the confusion, the Last Location was shown as Dawlish Warren, which is much too far away; I would have expected Topsham.

In the end, I chose Timetable options > Run to another timetable and selected 2E42, starting at Exmouth. Nothing much happened, so I selected Signalling options > Reverse direction and noticed it stopped at Exmouth. So the buffer stop was past Exmouth, which makes sense. I told the driver to Shunt forward (get going) and the train is proceeding normally Up towards Topsham now.

How would I have to edit the TT to prevent this from recurring? At least one other train (I forget the headcode) does this in this TT. I assume this is a TT error as other trains in the same TT behave normally and stop at Exmouth.

Thanks. Saved game enclosed.


[attachment=2530]SnapshotAt2430.ssg[/attachment]
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Last edited: 26/06/2014 at 14:08 by maxand
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Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop 26/06/2014 at 14:14 #62090
Steamer
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3925 posts 		Did you do anything unusual with the train between Newton Abbot and Exmouth, e.g. using 'shunt forward' to get it moving ?

The timetable validates, and I've not encountered anything like this while testing my new Exeter TT, so it doesn't sound like a bug.
"Don't stress/ relax/ let life roll off your backs./ Except for death and paying taxes/ everything in life.../ is only for now." (Avenue Q)
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Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop 26/06/2014 at 14:22 #62091
Stephen Fulcher
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2028 posts 		It would have had to be reversed at Exeter St Davids as well.

Could you have used shunt forward to get it out of Dawlish Warren? I don't think the timetable would step if you did this as it would not have departed from there in the normal manner.
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Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop 26/06/2014 at 14:29 #62093
TimTamToe
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656 posts 		Sounds as though you have either used shunt forward at dawlish warren or used shunt signals instead of full aspects which had caused the TT not to step up. Sounds like a user error rather than a TT error.
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Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop 26/06/2014 at 14:31 #62094
peterb
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451 posts 		Looks like something untoward has happened to this train - it is expecting the next station to be Dawlish, but has continued on since it has not reached it. Did you meddle with the timetable or train at all?

To get it where it is now, you would have had to manually reverse the train at St. Davids yourself, it wouldn't have done that on its own.

Whatever has happened to it, you would have to F2->Edit timetable->Set next (correct) location for the train to behave normally. This clearly hasn't been done.
Last edited: 26/06/2014 at 15:51 by peterb
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Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop 26/06/2014 at 14:50 #62099
maxand
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1637 posts 		Thanks for all your replies. No, I don't recall using Shunt forward in any of these locations; the run from Dawlish/Dawlish Warren is pretty straightforward. I didn't edit the TT, nor used shunt signals instead of running ones.

Stephen Fulcher wrote:
Quote:
It would have had to be reversed at Exeter St Davids as well.
As I recall this is all built into its TT and it did this without any prompting from me.

peterb wrote:
Quote:
Whatever has happened to it, you would have to F2->Edit timetable->Set next (correct) location for the train to behave normally. This clearly hasn't been done.

Trying to do this is complicated by the fact that it needs to reverse at the buffer stop to get back to Exmouth. So rather than do this, I made it run to its next service TT, which is 2E42. However, just for the hell of it I might replay this scenario and try your suggestion. Is SimSig smart enough to reverse a train to return it to its pre-overshoot position?

It's still unclear why it overshot Exmouth in the first place, after behaving normally passing through Topsham and the other timing points to Exmouth. It's also the second train in this TT to do this, and I don't think I would have done anything untoward in the previous case, that's why I suspect a TT error, rather than a user error.

It quite possibly may have been my fault, though it's going to be difficult to duplicate this, not knowing where to start.

Maybe someone who has encountered this overshoot problem at another location in another sim can throw further light on this.
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Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop 26/06/2014 at 14:55 #62100
peterb
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451 posts 		" said:
Trying to do this is complicated by the fact that it needs to reverse at the buffer stop to get back to Exmouth.
You should have stepped the timetable up prior to arrival at St Davids, let alone Exmouth, when you should have seen the timetable wasn't stepping up correctly.

As I said, the train is expecting to stop next at Dawlish. This means it will not stop at Exmouth, indeed it would not have stopped at any stations between Starcross and Exmouth (including St. Davids).
Last edited: 26/06/2014 at 15:49 by peterb
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Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop 26/06/2014 at 15:09 #62103
AndyG
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1835 posts 		It hasn't 'overshot' Exmouth as such, it's at Exmouth merely facing the wrong way as it's still trying to reach Dawlish.

Maybe its TT was changed after leaving ExSD, eg by running to another TT but not setting the current location correctly (eg whilst at StD facing Exe Cen, setting TT to 2F30 but current location Dawlish would give rise to this).

If at any point before arrival arrival at Exmouth the TT location was updated, then the train would take up its next working OK.

I suspect the 6x speed hasn't helped matters either.
I can only help one person a day. Today's not your day. Tomorrow doesn't look too good either.
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Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop 26/06/2014 at 15:42 #62104
Steamer
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3925 posts 		Problem found- the location list goes "Teignmouth, Dawlish Warren, Dawlish, Starcross", when it should read "Teignmouth, Dawlish, Dawlish Warren, Starcross". That would explain why it thinks it's at Dawlish. This would appear to be a bug with the TT editor- the timetable as it is validates perfectly, although it does throw up an error in the TT analyser. Apologies for suspecting user error.

AndyG said:
I suspect the 6x speed hasn't helped matters either.
Isn't that the last speed you had- when I started the save it was at 1.5x, the last speed I used.
"Don't stress/ relax/ let life roll off your backs./ Except for death and paying taxes/ everything in life.../ is only for now." (Avenue Q)
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Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop 26/06/2014 at 22:51 #62133
maxand
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1637 posts 		Thanks Steamer for finding the cause.
Quote:
This would appear to be a bug with the TT editor- the timetable as it is validates perfectly

(edited) I assume that by this you mean the TT editor (F4) in SimSig.

Is the solution a simple matter of editing the Location List to swap Dawlish Warren with Dawlish?

AndyG wrote:
Quote:
I suspect the 6x speed hasn't helped matters either.

I don't know where you got this from - I was playing at 1:1 speed and the saved game I posted should have reflected this.

peterb wrote:
Quote:
You should have stepped the timetable up prior to arrival at St Davids, let alone Exmouth, when you should have seen the timetable wasn't stepping up correctly.

I don't understand what you mean by "stepping up" a timetable. Would you please clarify this?

(added) I see you've just explained it in this post in another thread. Thanks.
Last edited: 26/06/2014 at 23:14 by maxand
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Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop 27/06/2014 at 04:00 #62142
BarryM
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2158 posts 		2F29 TT is out of sync as well.

Barry
Barry, Sydney, New South Wales, Australia
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The following user said thank you: maxand
Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop 27/06/2014 at 07:32 #62144
Steamer
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3925 posts 		" said:
Thanks Steamer for finding the cause.
Quote:
This would appear to be a bug with the TT editor- the timetable as it is validates perfectly

(edited) I assume that by this you mean the TT editor (F4) in SimSig.

Is the solution a simple matter of editing the Location List to swap Dawlish Warren with Dawlish?
Yep- highlight 'Dawlish' and click 'move up'. It won't fix the problem you're in at the moment, but if you edit the train in the TT editor and save the timetable you won't get the same problem next time.
"Don't stress/ relax/ let life roll off your backs./ Except for death and paying taxes/ everything in life.../ is only for now." (Avenue Q)
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The following user said thank you: maxand
Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop 27/06/2014 at 12:06 #62152
Hugh Jampton
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69 posts 		" said:


AndyG wrote:
Quote:
I suspect the 6x speed hasn't helped matters either.

I don't know where you got this from - I was playing at 1:1 speed and the saved game I posted should have reflected this.
As far as I can see, when I open a saved file, the simulation speed is not determined by the saved game but by the speed that was set the last time I played Simsig. For example, I got caught out once with King's Cross. I had been playing solo at 1:1 speed, then I joined a multiplayer host which was set at double speed, then when I next opened Simsig to resume my original solo game it too started at double speed (and chaos ensued, of course.)
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Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop 27/06/2014 at 12:22 #62153
JamesN
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1577 posts 		The simulation speed setting on your own PC is not affected by either save games or clienting on a multiplayer.
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Train overshoots Exmouth and goes to buffer stop 27/06/2014 at 13:06 #62155
Stumpy21
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2 posts 		Please forgive me if this is incorrect, but being a newcomer to SimSig I am not sure if this is relevant to the original question?

Living in Exeter I was interested in this simulation and thought I would load up a hopefully not too demanding timetable.
I had a problem with it, so I loaded up the Timetable editor to examine and also try to teach myself some of the operations of SimSig.
I ran the "Analyse Now" function under "Tools 1" and, with apologise to Tim Squires, set about editing/correcting the various listed warnings. Just leaving the termination warnings, which I take it are normal?

I am not sure if this cures maxand's problem, but I have attached my modified timetable, named as V3.1
If any of this is not appropriate etc. would a moderator please edit/delete as necessary.

Derek
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