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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC?

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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 02/05/2015 at 03:11 #71618
maxand
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Anyone unfamiliar with Derby RTC should perhaps first read these two threads:

Where is Derby RTC (and others needing a phone call)?
Where is Derby Way & Works Siding?

In the default TT (in my case, commencing from 12:00), at 05:10 I have 4Z09 at signal 433, direction UP. Its TT calls for it to travel along the DGL (same direction), then along the Derby Way & Works Siding (between signals 428 and 425, but UP, I expect), then terminate at Derby RTC (either Research or P.Way siding).

My problem is that I still cannot work out what routes to set to get it there. From 433 there is no simple route to the DGL without, it seems, having to route it to CHAD CURVE then signalling it to reverse back to the DGL. Its TT does not mention reversing. Once on the DGL the logical point of entry into Derby RTC is via Research Siding; again this would require reversing all the way back, which doesn't seem right.

Likewise, any trains approaching DOWN from Sheet Stores Jn would need to reverse somewhere between Derby and Derby DGL before making it to Derby RTC, unless they stop and reverse at signal 430 back to Research Siding.

I cannot determine the TT writer's intent here. Would someone tell me how it's done? Not a problem for trains approaching Derby from the opposite direction, as they would proceed UP along the GL, then through Derby W&W and into the RTC.

Thanks for your assistance

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Last edited: 02/05/2015 at 03:12 by maxand
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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 02/05/2015 at 03:25 #71619
John
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4Z09 has been wrong routed towards 433.

At the previous signal 379 at Nnw Jn Derby, it should have been routed to 436 on the Down Goods, then to 458 and reverse on 448 to 425 and into the Research Siding (RTC).

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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 02/05/2015 at 03:55 #71620
officer dibble
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It is a good idea for anything heading into the RTC at Derby to phone up well in advance for a slot, as there a 2 entrances to this location (as I discovered to my cost recently :doh )

1) If the train is accepted via the "P.way Siding" then the train can be reversed in platform 1,2 or 3 at Derby, and the train be put straight into this siding by simply routing from the platform starter signal.

2) If the train is accepted via the "Research Sdg" the a train can be reversed on the DGL adjacent to Derby station and can be put into the RTC by routing 448-425 & then into the RTC accordingly. Remember if the train is to be reversed in the DGL & is coming from Stenson Junction it must go over to the Goods line @ LNW Derby Junction to facilitate this.

Hope this helps.

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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 02/05/2015 at 08:31 #71623
maxand
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Thanks both of you for your help. Dunno how I missed the obvious!

On the subject of phoning Derby RTC well in advance, I did this, got permission, then had to exit, saving my current situation before quitting.

On starting another session (resuming at the time saved), I carried on as before, but when the train entered the RTC I was informed that no permission had been given - more penalty points. I should have phoned again and maybe reversed the train, waiting for a fresh permission.

I can't remembering experiencing this problem before, but if permissions are not saved along with the sim then it would apply to all sims, not just Derby.

Last edited: 02/05/2015 at 08:41 by maxand
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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 02/05/2015 at 22:54 #71661
Airvan00
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I think the does (did) apply to other sims. I remember having the problem with Westbury. I got into the habit of never saving a sim while I had an outstanding permission.
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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 03/05/2015 at 03:41 #71663
maxand
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In that case, the devs should fix this one. If permission is given but not saved, then when the sim resumes the train may be too close to its destination to phone again before it enters the yard or whatever.
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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 03/05/2015 at 05:42 #71664
BarryM
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May the Lord give us strength. So what? Anybody would think that money was involved in performances.
Barry, Sydney, New South Wales, Australia
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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 03/05/2015 at 06:56 #71665
maxand
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If that's true, you ought to be quite rich by now.
Last edited: 03/05/2015 at 06:59 by maxand
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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 06/05/2015 at 12:57 #71788
clive
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" said:
In that case, the devs should fix this one.
I agree. Mantis 13136 raised.

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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 06/05/2015 at 23:24 #71857
uboat
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some pay rises are based on performances.
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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 07/05/2015 at 11:48 #71882
bfcmik
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I'm a truck driver - what is this 'pay rise' thing you are talking about? :dry:
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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 07/05/2015 at 11:49 #71883
headshot119
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" said:
I'm a truck driver - what is this 'pay rise' thing you are talking about? :dry:
That once a year miracle when the National Minimum Wage goes up 10p or so!

"CHECK Do you stop at Capenhurst?" - Opinions are my own and not those of my employer
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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 19/05/2015 at 11:06 #72459
gricehead
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Piggy backing on this thread for further help, hope you don't mind.

I've had 4Z09 accepted by Derby RTC into P'way siding. I've routed it to Derby station and then to the P'way siding exit arrow. It's now calling in at signal 423 (P'way siding exit) "waiting for right of way at Derby Way & Works Siding".

What is the correct action? Or have I done something wrong?

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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 12/10/2019 at 21:10 #120968
9pN1SEAp
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I can't see in https://www.simsig.co.uk/Wiki/Show?page=simulations:derby:panels any mention of slotting Derby RTC?
Jamie S (JAMS)
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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 12/10/2019 at 21:26 #120972
Albert
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No the wiki needs an update there.

Anyway the idea is to call RTC and if it offers you the wrong line, cancel acceptance and request it again. You need it to say Research siding if your train comes from the GL or Way&Works Sdg and P'way if your train comes from the station.

I'd also like to see an update to the Way & Works Siding location in the wiki: the pilot line works as well, and it is longer (even though it seems the same length in the sim). Makes it easier to reverse an HST set which would foul the points of the goods lines if routed onto the Connect line.

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Last edited: 12/10/2019 at 21:27 by Albert
Reason: None given

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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 12/10/2019 at 21:45 #120974
jc92
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Albert in post 120972 said:
No the wiki needs an update there.

Anyway the idea is to call RTC and if it offers you the wrong line, cancel acceptance and request it again. You need it to say Research siding if your train comes from the GL or Way&Works Sdg and P'way if your train comes from the station.

I'd also like to see an update to the Way & Works Siding location in the wiki: the pilot line works as well, and it is longer (even though it seems the same length in the sim). Makes it easier to reverse an HST set which would foul the points of the goods lines if routed onto the Connect line.
In real life theres no location for the pilot line. the WTT says way and works siding and its up to the signalman to pick which line he prefers at the time. I always use the pilot line for depot shunts or when the goods lines aren't needed. the pilot line is primarily designed for shunting between EPS and 4 shed.

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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 13/10/2019 at 00:01 #120979
Albert
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Yes, what you just said confirms my suggestion to update the wiki.

(Coincidentally, in the Summer 1992 TT, shunts between EPS and 4 Shed are done by reversing at SJN, not on the pilot line. Is this realistic?)

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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 13/10/2019 at 10:30 #120982
jc92
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Albert in post 120979 said:
Yes, what you just said confirms my suggestion to update the wiki.

(Coincidentally, in the Summer 1992 TT, shunts between EPS and 4 Shed are done by reversing at SJN, not on the pilot line. Is this realistic?)
Within the limitations of the sim. IRL most reversed on the pilot line however its not possible to do that in the sim without the trains stopping in the wrong place so I've used SNJ.

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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 13/10/2019 at 12:11 #120983
Phil-jmw
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jc92 in post 120982 said:
Albert in post 120979 said:
Yes, what you just said confirms my suggestion to update the wiki.

(Coincidentally, in the Summer 1992 TT, shunts between EPS and 4 Shed are done by reversing at SJN, not on the pilot line. Is this realistic?)
Within the limitations of the sim. IRL most reversed on the pilot line however its not possible to do that in the sim without the trains stopping in the wrong place so I've used SNJ.
Which reversals are we talking about here?

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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 13/10/2019 at 12:36 #120984
Phil-jmw
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Albert in post 120972 said:
No the wiki needs an update there.

Anyway the idea is to call RTC and if it offers you the wrong line, cancel acceptance and request it again. You need it to say Research siding if your train comes from the GL or Way&Works Sdg and P'way if your train comes from the station.
In reality when the signalman offers a train to the RTC the shunter tells him which entrance to send it in via ("in at 418" or "in at 423", referring to the numbers of the outlet signals), and it is then up to the signalman to route the train accordingly to a platform, goods or pilot line to be able to access the correct RTC entrance. This is how I run trains in the sim.

Albert in post 120972 said:
I'd also like to see an update to the Way & Works Siding location in the wiki: the pilot line works as well, and it is longer (even though it seems the same length in the sim). Makes it easier to reverse an HST set which would foul the points of the goods lines if routed onto the Connect line.
Both the Pilot and Connecting lines were used for shunting in and out of Etches Park, but predominantly the Pilot line as when a route was set from DY426 to the Pilot it remained 'Off' until the route was cancelled so the Park could shunt to their heart's content without having to request the signal every time. The Park supervisor would ask "can I have the dolly for a shunt and the signalman would set a route and leve it set until either the Park told him they were done with it or the signalman had another move to make and would ring the Park to ask for it back.

Yes a full HST would fit on the Pilot between DY427 and DY479 Sigs, if shunting an HST on the Connecting line ("can I have a shunt 'up the straight'?" ) you had to clear DY428 to allow it to fit behind DY425.

Interesting fact 1:- When a route was set from DY422 towards DY428 on the Connecting line the theatre indicator did not illuminate a 'C' for Connecting Line (as it was labelled on the panel), it illuminated an 'N' for Neutral, as the Connecting line was also called.

Interesting Fact 2:- When a route was set from DY422 or DY430 to Pfm.5 the theatre indicator did not illuminate with a number (5) as it did for the other platforms (1,2,3,4,6), it illuminated with a 'B' for Bay.

Phil.

Last edited: 13/10/2019 at 12:38 by Phil-jmw
Reason: None given

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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 14/10/2019 at 18:03 #121016
VInce
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Phil-jmw in post 120984 said:
[quote=Albert;post=120972]No the wiki needs an update there.

Interesting Fact 2:- When a route was set from DY422 or DY430 to Pfm.5 the theatre indicator did not illuminate with a number (5) as it did for the other platforms (1,2,3,4,6), it illuminated with a 'B' for Bay.

Phil.
Not wishing to be pedantic Phil, but it was impossible to get into 4,5 or 6 from DY430.

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How to get Main Line trains into Derby RTC? 14/10/2019 at 23:56 #121040
Phil-jmw
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VInce in post 121016 said:
Phil-jmw in post 120984 said:
[quote=Albert;post=120972]No the wiki needs an update there.

Interesting Fact 2:- When a route was set from DY422 or DY430 to Pfm.5 the theatre indicator did not illuminate with a number (5) as it did for the other platforms (1,2,3,4,6), it illuminated with a 'B' for Bay.

Phil.
Not wishing to be pedantic Phil, but it was impossible to get into 4,5 or 6 from DY430.
Thanks for spotting my deliberate mistake Vince, yes sorry I meant DY433 on the Up Main(West).

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