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Level Crossing Bug?

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Level Crossing Bug? 16/10/2018 at 09:32 #112666
ajax103
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I'm currently playing 58050's 1994 to 1995 timetable on Easy setting which to me ought to mean no faults period.

However Fobbing AHB near Pitsea and Stanford-Le-Hope on the seems to vary between Fault (in red) and Raised/Working (in white)...

Now I've asked the driver of 7Z01 to check the line thinking they would be able to check the crossing barriers too but it seems they're only interested in a actual obstruction on the line...

So how come this is happening? What is the procedure to do as I doubt I'm meant to send trains though at line speed or am I?

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Level Crossing Bug? 16/10/2018 at 12:39 #112671
jc92
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It shows failed because it has remained down longer than its meant to. This is because the tamper is travelling at 2mph so hits the trigger TC but doesn't clear the crossing like a normal trains do.

What your seeing is the correct indication from the crossing warning you it has been down too long and therefore road users might start crossing it of their own accord

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Level Crossing Bug? 16/10/2018 at 12:41 #112673
AlexRail575
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Which sim?

I haven't heard of LC's failing in game before... this is probably caused by the train taking an unusually long time before crossing the barriers (which, given that it's a freight with headcode 7, max 45 MPH, isn't that surprising, even ignoring that it's actually going much slower...).

[Oh sorry for the double post somebody seems to have been quicker than me...]

Last edited: 16/10/2018 at 12:43 by AlexRail575
Reason: None given

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Level Crossing Bug? 16/10/2018 at 15:08 #112674
headshot119
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If you are certain that the failure of the AHBC was due to prolonged occupation of the crossing track circuit then:

- If the crossing returns to the correct state nothing needs to be done
- If the crossing is still showing failed when the next train arrives you need to advise the driver to approach the crossing at caution, pass over only if safe to do so.

"James Street, Moorfields, Liverpool Lime Street and Liverpool Central"
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Level Crossing Bug? 16/10/2018 at 18:52 #112689
ajax103
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headshot119 in post 112674 said:
If you are certain that the failure of the AHBC was due to prolonged occupation of the crossing track circuit then:

- If the crossing returns to the correct state nothing needs to be done
- If the crossing is still showing failed when the next train arrives you need to advise the driver to approach the crossing at caution, pass over only if safe to do so.
Approach the crossing at caution that is the same as check for obstructions right?

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Level Crossing Bug? 16/10/2018 at 20:14 #112692
headshot119
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ajax103 in post 112689 said:
headshot119 in post 112674 said:
If you are certain that the failure of the AHBC was due to prolonged occupation of the crossing track circuit then:

- If the crossing returns to the correct state nothing needs to be done
- If the crossing is still showing failed when the next train arrives you need to advise the driver to approach the crossing at caution, pass over only if safe to do so.
Approach the crossing at caution that is the same as check for obstructions right?
In SimSig for all intents and purposes yes. In real life no.

"James Street, Moorfields, Liverpool Lime Street and Liverpool Central"
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Level Crossing Bug? 18/10/2018 at 01:03 #112719
Phil-jmw
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If you use the Emergency Replacement button on 730 signal it suppresses the strike-in for Fobbing LC (and simulates to some extent the barriers being on local control, which they would be for a machine working in the vicinity of the crossing controls (treadles and track circuits)). Wait for 7Z01 to call up from 730 signal then reset the Emergency Replacement button and this will cause the crossing to activate. The barriers will still show failed after approx 3 & 1/2 mins because of the time it takes 7Z01 to clear the crossing but at least they aren't down for half an hour before 7Z01 gets there.
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Level Crossing Bug? 18/10/2018 at 15:06 #112728
clive
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Phil-jmw in post 112719 said:
If you use the Emergency Replacement button on 730 signal it suppresses the strike-in for Fobbing LC (and simulates to some extent the barriers being on local control, which they would be for a machine working in the vicinity of the crossing controls (treadles and track circuits)).
Looking at typical circuits, an AHB in local control should show as failed on the panel. In fact, as soon as someone opens the door to the control room or cabinet it should show failed.

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Level Crossing Bug? 18/10/2018 at 16:53 #112729
jc92
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clive in post 112728 said:
Phil-jmw in post 112719 said:
If you use the Emergency Replacement button on 730 signal it suppresses the strike-in for Fobbing LC (and simulates to some extent the barriers being on local control, which they would be for a machine working in the vicinity of the crossing controls (treadles and track circuits)).
Looking at typical circuits, an AHB in local control should show as failed on the panel. In fact, as soon as someone opens the door to the control room or cabinet it should show failed.
Incidentally (although perhaps a discussion in its own right) could an option to fail or take local control of an AHB be added to the incident control panel? Might come in handy for certain scenarios.

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Level Crossing Bug? 18/10/2018 at 17:32 #112730
9pN1SEAp
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I find it bizarre that a failed AHB doesn't seem to be interlocked to the signalling to prevent trains flying through at line speed.
Jamie S (JAMS)
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Level Crossing Bug? 18/10/2018 at 19:48 #112733
jc92
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9pN1SEAp in post 112730 said:
I find it bizarre that a failed AHB doesn't seem to be interlocked to the signalling to prevent trains flying through at line speed.
Probably because its effectively a right side failure (barriers stuck down preventing traffic, rather than stuck raised) and there's also a chance of an unnecessary SPAD if the signal is thrown back in front of a train when the AHB is failed but still safe.

Last edited: 18/10/2018 at 19:49 by jc92
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Level Crossing Bug? 19/10/2018 at 18:56 #112749
Phil-jmw
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clive in post 112728 said:
Phil-jmw in post 112719 said:
If you use the Emergency Replacement button on 730 signal it suppresses the strike-in for Fobbing LC (and simulates to some extent the barriers being on local control, which they would be for a machine working in the vicinity of the crossing controls (treadles and track circuits)).
Looking at typical circuits, an AHB in local control should show as failed on the panel. In fact, as soon as someone opens the door to the control room or cabinet it should show failed.
By 'control room' do you mean relay room? I wouldn't think that opening a relay room door would cause the barriers to indicate failed, but opening the control panel door on the barrier pedestal might (I'll bow to greater knowledge on this one). Level Crossing Attendants are required to contact the signaller before opening anything so that there are no nasty surprises with crossings alarming as failed.

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Level Crossing Bug? 19/10/2018 at 19:40 #112750
Stephen Fulcher
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Opening the door to either the Local Control Unit or the barrier machines themselves will cause the crossing to show failed, although some older installations will have a time delay before it does.

The relay room door won't, but it might have an intruder alarm that sometimes repeats back to the signal box if the technician is too slow to cancel it.

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Level Crossing Bug? 19/10/2018 at 23:03 #112754
clive
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jc92 in post 112729 said:

Incidentally (although perhaps a discussion in its own right) could an option to fail or take local control of an AHB be added to the incident control panel? Might come in handy for certain scenarios.
Option to fail doesn't seem worth it; a real AHB will report failure when the relevant conditions happen, not just arbitrarily.

Local control is a thought. Mantis 21948.

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Level Crossing Bug? 20/10/2018 at 11:55 #112755
Peter Bennet
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jc92 in post 112733 said:
9pN1SEAp in post 112730 said:
I find it bizarre that a failed AHB doesn't seem to be interlocked to the signalling to prevent trains flying through at line speed.
Probably because its effectively a right side failure (barriers stuck down preventing traffic, rather than stuck raised) and there's also a chance of an unnecessary SPAD if the signal is thrown back in front of a train when the AHB is failed but still safe.
Though given it's a half-barrier that's a presumption based on the compliant behaviour of a motorist sat there for a while.

Peter

There is no such thing as public opinion. There is only published opinion. Winston Churchill
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