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Piccadilly 2020

You are here: Home > Forum > Simulations > Timetables > Manchester Piccadilly > Piccadilly 2020

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Piccadilly 2020 29/12/2019 at 13:48 #122629
Splodge
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It's in the early stages, but I'm announcing this now in case anyone else is doing the same thing so I don't duplicate ongoing work.

Following the infamous 2018 timetable recast, the TT is unrecognisable from previously released versions, and presents some new challenges for players to get to grips with. Although the sim hasn't been updated to reflect these, I reckon the workarounds I have done should allow a playable TT, and should offer the challenge that faces the real signallers every day!

The most obvious of these are the Ordsall Chord and electrification of the Bolton corridor - to get around this, services to/from Victoria that use the Chord are entering/leaving at Eccles; and EMU services using the Bolton line are now bi-modes. Testing indicates that on a clear run these bi-modes can maintain timings despite higher speed limits now being in force. There are a few minor layout/signalling changes as well, but so far these don't appear to be causing any significant issues.

Currently through the Piccadilly rush hour so hopefully can make quicker progress on the more clock-face daytime schedules before adding the non-Chord Victoria moves and other services such as the Liverpool-Oxford Road stoppers.

There's the right way, the wrong way and the railway.
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The following users said thank you: BarryM, Woodhead Signalman
Piccadilly 2020 18/03/2020 at 21:39 #123825
Splodge
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Pleased to announce this TT has been completed, tested and uploaded and is now awaiting approval. With 1,696 trains to keep you busy over almost 24 hours of simulated movements, this is a challenging simulation even in easy mode - and I accept no responsibility for stress induced if anyone wishes to add delays and failures into the mix (rest assured, just like the real timetable, things collapse very quickly!).
There's the right way, the wrong way and the railway.
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The following users said thank you: BarryM, bossman, AlexH
Piccadilly 2020 05/06/2020 at 20:27 #127377
Elliott142
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Hi! I've been using this timetable for a fair bit now and it is fantastic, However one train I can't get to move at all is 4F01, 08:04 out of Brindle Heath, even when I "force" it to pass the signal at danger, it doesn't move at all? There is probably something I'm not doing right to get it out but if anybody can point me in the right direction that would be great!
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Piccadilly 2020 05/06/2020 at 22:01 #127378
Splodge
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Just to check - are you bringing it out of the Up Sidings (technically Pendleton Stone Terminal) and not the refuse sidings?
There's the right way, the wrong way and the railway.
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The following user said thank you: Elliott142
Piccadilly 2020 06/06/2020 at 19:01 #127383
Elliott142
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That deserves a massive facepalm, no wonder it wasn't moving, I was indeed routing it out of the wrong place!! Let's forget I ever asked, I'll accept the PX for that one! Thank you haha!
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Piccadilly 2020 26/06/2020 at 00:29 #128024
Splodge
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Pleased to report that updating this to the latest 2019 layout, taking full advantage of the Ordsall Chord and Bolton alterations in V2, has taken less than an evenings work. I'm running through it to ensure there are no nasties and will hopefully have it ready to release within a week.
There's the right way, the wrong way and the railway.
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The following users said thank you: Sidestick Priority, BarryM, Trainfan344, phil1044
Piccadilly 2020 07/07/2020 at 17:55 #129216
Splodge
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Slightly longer than anticipated, but v1.1 has been submitted and should be available soon. This makes full use of the Ordsall Chord and Bolton layout changes.

I haven't tested it with ARS but don't anticipate any issues. ACI is a Godsend and takes a lot of pressure off!

There's the right way, the wrong way and the railway.
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The following users said thank you: Trainfan344, jc92, rodney30, Phil-jmw
Piccadilly 2020 08/07/2020 at 01:00 #129258
Phil-jmw
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Are there any overnight infrastructure monitoring trains in this TT? I find they can brighten up an otherwise quiet wee small hours. Just recently I've started adding one or two ultrasonic trains to TT's that don't have any just to make more of the early hours, as even if there wasn't one booked to run on the date of a particular TT, recovery shifts can run any time.

Phil.

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Piccadilly 2020 08/07/2020 at 08:56 #129268
Splodge
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The TT starts at 0300 (until 0300 the next day) so doesn't take too long to get into the swing of things with TPE night trains and various ECS and freight trains. Various infrastructure trains are included over the 24 hour period, as well as some freight moves which are in the WTT but didn't run on the day.

Also just to note, the TT is now re-versioned as 2.0 in the SimSig download area and will show as such in the F4 window.,

There's the right way, the wrong way and the railway.
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The following user said thank you: Phil-jmw
Piccadilly 2020 08/07/2020 at 17:31 #129292
Splodge
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Now available

https://www.simsig.co.uk/File/Details/2433

There's the right way, the wrong way and the railway.
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The following users said thank you: headshot119, Trainfan344, oj12103, Phil-jmw
Piccadilly 2020 08/07/2020 at 21:31 #129315
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Thank you for this Timetable, it's brilliant to finally get usage of the update. Have you thought about doing a 2020 for Manchester East and possibly even Manchester North when the sim is updated?
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Piccadilly 2020 08/07/2020 at 21:43 #129317
bnsf734
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Many thanks for this timetable and the updated layout of the Sim with Ordsall and Bolton. Downloaded the timetable and started a play making full use of ARS!.
I have got to 0359 and just got an Error Message window:

Internal Error Exception 5C31 in Enter (EInvalidOp:Invalid Floating Point Operation)

Sim continued once I had pressed OK and 5C31 appeared non-ARS.

A few minutes later another 5C31 appeared at the same location.

0350 Save File attached.

Hope this helps

Calvin

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Last edited: 08/07/2020 at 21:48 by bnsf734
Reason: None given

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Piccadilly 2020 08/07/2020 at 21:57 #129319
Meld
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Have just run from the save without any issue - try restarting from the save an see if it happens again
Passed the age to be doing 'Spoon Feeding' !!!
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Piccadilly 2020 08/07/2020 at 22:05 #129321
Splodge
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oj12103 in post 129315 said:
Thank you for this Timetable, it's brilliant to finally get usage of the update. Have you thought about doing a 2020 for Manchester East and possibly even Manchester North when the sim is updated?
Manchester East would be a possibility as I still have the diagram information, but I don't have any actual TT data for either.

There's the right way, the wrong way and the railway.
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The following user said thank you: oj12103
Piccadilly 2020 08/07/2020 at 22:15 #129322
bnsf734
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Tried again from the save and it happened again as before. Once it happened trains moving in Picadilly throat were not clearing their paths.

Will try again from start.

Calvin

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Piccadilly 2020 08/07/2020 at 22:23 #129324
bnsf734
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Tried again from a fresh start and changed the entry time to 0309 and the same error occurred.

Other trains were entering OK from other entry points.

Calvin

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Piccadilly 2020 08/07/2020 at 22:36 #129326
Steamer
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bnsf734 in post 129317 said:
Many thanks for this timetable and the updated layout of the Sim with Ordsall and Bolton. Downloaded the timetable and started a play making full use of ARS!.
I have got to 0359 and just got an Error Message window:

Internal Error Exception 5C31 in Enter (EInvalidOp:Invalid Floating Point Operation)

Sim continued once I had pressed OK and 5C31 appeared non-ARS.

A few minutes later another 5C31 appeared at the same location.

0350 Save File attached.

Hope this helps

Calvin
Is the train entering at Longsight? This sounds very similar to an issue another user had with my Sunday 2018 timetable, but I wasn't able to re-create it on my machine- though bizarrely, said user encountered the issue every time they ran the TT.

"Don't stress/ relax/ let life roll off your backs./ Except for death and paying taxes/ everything in life.../ is only for now." (Avenue Q)
Last edited: 08/07/2020 at 22:37 by Steamer
Reason: None given

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Piccadilly 2020 08/07/2020 at 23:23 #129329
bnsf734
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Yes its Longsight Hyde Road entry point.
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Piccadilly 2020 09/07/2020 at 00:01 #129331
Phil-jmw
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Steamer in post 129326 said:
bnsf734 in post 129317 said:
Many thanks for this timetable and the updated layout of the Sim with Ordsall and Bolton. Downloaded the timetable and started a play making full use of ARS!.
I have got to 0359 and just got an Error Message window:

Internal Error Exception 5C31 in Enter (EInvalidOp:Invalid Floating Point Operation)

Sim continued once I had pressed OK and 5C31 appeared non-ARS.

A few minutes later another 5C31 appeared at the same location.

0350 Save File attached.

Hope this helps

Calvin
Is the train entering at Longsight? This sounds very similar to an issue another user had with my Sunday 2018 timetable, but I wasn't able to re-create it on my machine- though bizarrely, said user encountered the issue every time they ran the TT.
It was me that had the issues with the Sun 2017 TT, first noticed with 5S12 entering at Longsight. See this thread https://www.simsig.co.uk/Forum/ThreadView/50908 for details.

After 3 days detective work I discovered the issue was trains timed via the Up & Dn Goods line from Longsight to Ardwick Jn, regardless of which Longsight entry point they were timed to enter at. Retime them FL and the problem is solved (you can still signal them via the Goods). Incidentally, when 5C31 entered non-ARS, in the F4 list was it still in bold type as if unentered? This happened with 5S12 in the Sun 2017 TT. If you retime all the ECS FL from Longsight though, the trains will enter in ARS with no error messages, and won't duplicate enter a few mins later.

Phil.

Last edited: 09/07/2020 at 00:12 by Phil-jmw
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Piccadilly 2020 09/07/2020 at 00:28 #129333
bnsf734
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Thanks Phil. I will try that and see what happens.

Certainly seems a weird problem.

Calvin

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Piccadilly 2020 09/07/2020 at 00:42 #129334
Phil-jmw
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bnsf734 in post 129333 said:
Thanks Phil. I will try that and see what happens.

Certainly seems a weird problem.

Calvin
Indeed Calvin. 3 days head-scratching, nearly wore me a bald patch.

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Piccadilly 2020 09/07/2020 at 01:11 #129338
Meld
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BNSF - I should add, from your 0350 save - start paused, open 5C31s TT and validate the schedule, I forgot I did that before running the save.
Passed the age to be doing 'Spoon Feeding' !!!
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Piccadilly 2020 09/07/2020 at 01:30 #129339
bnsf734
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That worked fine Phil. Many thanks for your information. I have edited the timetable to remove reference to the Goods line for trains from Longsight and run a few more OK. Just need to remember that if its updated I will need to re-edit. I wonder why the error only appears on certain machines? Also what would happen if we run multiplayer (which I am sure we will) using the default timetable.

Calvin

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Piccadilly 2020 09/07/2020 at 08:24 #129350
Splodge
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I didn't test using ARS and had no problems (path was validated via the UDG) so that could be the culprit?
There's the right way, the wrong way and the railway.
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Piccadilly 2020 09/07/2020 at 11:48 #129361
Meld
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Splodge in post 129350 said:
I didn't test using ARS and had no problems (path was validated via the UDG) so that could be the culprit?
I've just about completed the 2019 TT and its about to undergo testing by the team.

In both the 15 & 19, as there are multiple entry points and having selected which one I want to enter, I always validate the schedule.

It may be that there is the odd slip up in the creation of schedules missing out a path or line code, by TT planners and not picked up by the dreaded Milton Keynes.

Passed the age to be doing 'Spoon Feeding' !!!
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