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Wrexham General to Wrexham Rev 1387 wrong route

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Wrexham General to Wrexham Rev 1387 wrong route 05/07/2014 at 19:54 #62481
Finger
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When setting a route from Wrexham General P3 to reversing point at CN 1387, Trains won't accept a direct route - they will only accept routes through the UGL. Is that intentional? I would expect them to just go there, just as they can get to CN1389.

You can see the situation with a train doing such move (and calling wrong route) in the attached save.

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Wrexham General to Wrexham Rev 1387 wrong route 05/07/2014 at 20:07 #62483
headshot119
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You will find that if you split the timetable at REV CN1387 with a next working activity there (Say to 1X00-1), then you won't have the issue.

The core code seems to read all the way through the timetable, and throws up the wrong route call if it finds any reference to the goods loop in it, even though it's being routed to the reverse point, it throws up the wrong route call.

I'm damned if I do, and damned if I don't. If I remove the wrong route call trains might end up on the mainline instead of the loop, if I leave it in you get the phone call.

"As the last track dropped, and the route became free, came the cry BROMLEY " - Opinions are my own and not those of my employer
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Wrexham General to Wrexham Rev 1387 wrong route 05/07/2014 at 20:16 #62484
JamesN
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Karl - why not use IVN= to exclude it rather than IVL=? will onyl look 2 locations forward then not whole TT
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Wrexham General to Wrexham Rev 1387 wrong route 05/07/2014 at 20:19 #62485
headshot119
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" said:
Karl - why not use IVN= to exclude it rather than IVL=? will onyl look 2 locations forward then not whole TT
That's the problem!

Wrexham General
Rev CN1387
Croes Newydd Goods

So it's 2 locations forward in the TT when the train is at Wrexham General.

"As the last track dropped, and the route became free, came the cry BROMLEY " - Opinions are my own and not those of my employer
Last edited: 05/07/2014 at 20:20 by headshot119
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Wrexham General to Wrexham Rev 1387 wrong route 05/07/2014 at 20:31 #62486
GeoffM
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Since signallers may well prefer to use the ML instead of the GL (regardless of what the TT says), it would be better to include the ML as part of the GL and take off the wrong route code.
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Wrexham General to Wrexham Rev 1387 wrong route 05/07/2014 at 20:47 #62488
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" said:
Since signallers may well prefer to use the ML instead of the GL (regardless of what the TT says), it would be better to include the ML as part of the GL and take off the wrong route code.
Call removed ready for the next update after a discussion with Geoff.

"As the last track dropped, and the route became free, came the cry BROMLEY " - Opinions are my own and not those of my employer
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Wrexham General to Wrexham Rev 1387 wrong route 10/07/2014 at 07:20 #62614
clive
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" said:


The core code seems to read all the way through the timetable, and throws up the wrong route call if it finds any reference to the goods loop in it, even though it's being routed to the reverse point, it throws up the wrong route call.

I've just checked the core code, and it definitely stops doing wrong-route checks at the first reversing point.

If you send me the sim data and an example saved game, I can investigate further.

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Wrexham General to Wrexham Rev 1387 wrong route 10/07/2014 at 09:22 #62615
Sacro
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" said:

I've just checked the core code, and it definitely stops doing wrong-route checks at the first reversing point.
How does it detect a 'reversing point'? If it's guessing based on a switch from up to down, it might not pick up on certain layouts.

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Wrexham General to Wrexham Rev 1387 wrong route 10/07/2014 at 09:45 #62616
clive
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" said:
" said:

I've just checked the core code, and it definitely stops doing wrong-route checks at the first reversing point.
How does it detect a 'reversing point'? If it's guessing based on a switch from up to down, it might not pick up on certain layouts.
Timetable validation is based on "paths" between "key locations" (any location you can reverse at or have actions at has to be a key location). Each path has a "start direction" and an "end direction"; if the end direction of one path is not the same as the start direction of the next path, that's a reverse.

Let me give you an example. Suppose we have a main line with key locations A, B, C, D in the down direction. B is the junction for a branch to X and Y, also in the down direction. There's also a chord between C and X, forming a triangle. That's a total of 12 paths:

A to B, start D end D / B to A, start U end U
B to C, start D end D / C to B, start U end U
C to D, start D end D / D to C, start U end U
B to X, start D end D / X to B, start U end U
X to Y, start D end D / Y to X, start U end U
C to X, start U end D / X to C, start U end D

To understand the last pair, an Up train from D goes round the chord and becomes a Down train heading for Y. For this purpose it doesn't matter where along the chord the direction changes.

This train from D to Y will be analysed as three paths: D-C, C-X, X-Y. At both C the end direction of D-C is U and the start direction of C-X is U, so there's no reverse. Similarly at X the end direction of C-X is D and the start direction of X-Y is D, so there's no reverse.

Now look at a train from D to Y reversing at B. This will be four paths: D-C, C-B, B-X, X-Y. At B the end direction of C-B is U but the start direction of B-X is D, so that's a reverse.

So it's not guessing, and won't be confused by certain layouts.

(There are some nasty edge cases. The Ely loop has both "start D end D" and "start U end D" paths between the same two locations, and the path selection is complicated as a result - from memory it uses the path and line codes, not just the locations. I do recall it took a lot of getting right.)

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Wrexham General to Wrexham Rev 1387 wrong route 10/07/2014 at 09:55 #62618
splash
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i have had no problems with trains reversing at cn1387 or cn1389
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