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Updated Groundhog day TT's

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Updated Groundhog day TT's 11/10/2017 at 21:18 #102178
Noisynoel
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Updated timetables for Peterborough for Groundhog day (15th October 2009) are available for download here https://www.simsig.co.uk/File/Details/1039 (Midnight start)
And here https://www.simsig.co.uk/File/Details/1040 (0445 start).
These have been re-written to modern standards and any bugs should be reported in this thread please :-)

Noisynoel
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The following users said thank you: MikeW, HST125Scorton, BarryM, simonstops, Trainfan344
Updated Groundhog day TT's 14/10/2017 at 13:33 #102248
Trainfan344
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Only a minor thing, but 2P00 is showing as being formed of 8/465. Presume this is meant to be 365.

EDIT

Having played the 04:45 Start version to 07:00, you have two trains wanting to use the DF to reverse at 07:00. 5P54 and 5P63 IIRC.

Last edited: 14/10/2017 at 14:01 by Trainfan344
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Updated Groundhog day TT's 14/10/2017 at 18:53 #102257
Noisynoel
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Ooops, force of habit as I'm always writing 8/465 at work!

I'll have a look at the other issue

Noisynoel
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Updated Groundhog day TT's 14/10/2017 at 20:46 #102261
Trainfan344
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5P53 and 5P64 are the issues.

Attached save of relevant time.

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Updated Groundhog day TT's 17/10/2017 at 17:03 #102350
Trainfan344
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Now at 10:00 Sim Time, I've found the following issues

3J32 and 3R94 should be booked via P4 at Biggleswade to reverse not P1.
2T46 is occupying P2 at Peterborough for about 4 hours, 1E02, 4O20 and 1A16 are all booked to use it while 2T46 is occupying the platform.
2P06 is Booked into Peterborough P3 at 10:04 while 1A16 is due to use P2 from 10:04 to 10:06 but 1A16 cannot use P2 if 2T46 is in the way.

Apart from these issues, the timetable is great and thanks for developing it!

Last edited: 17/10/2017 at 17:03 by Trainfan344
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Updated Groundhog day TT's 17/10/2017 at 20:08 #102355
Soton_Speed
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Thanks for updating the timetables to loader standards, crew changes make you think!

Couple of issues:

1. 1a04, 1a09, 1d42 & 1n13 should be formed of 225 stock but appear as a Cl67 L/E. Similarly 1e24 should be a 9-car GR HST.

2. 6e95 should be added into the 'are alternatives' chain with 6l95 & 6l76. Additionally, (4e25 & 4d56) and (6m87 & 4m84) should be alternatives.

3. 6e60 needs a rule to prevent it entering too early after 0e60 has exited. Similarly 0e57 vice 6l57.

4. 0e88 never makes it to Ketton ward Siding - no tt. There are in fact no trains that exit into Ketton Ward siding despite several coming out.

5. The Spalding shuttles need a little re-working:
2l53 next working should be 2k32
2k13 next working should be 2k38
2k17 next working should be 2k42 and the stock should be a 156
2k23 next working should be 2t46 and the stock should be a 153

Also may be some rules to prevent delayed trains re-entering too early at Spalding?


6. 3jXX rules need adjusting or implementing to prevent the train re-entering too early after it exits.

7. 0445 Start TT is missing 1p61 seed @ Peterborough P1.

8. Noticed that a couple of trains booked to stop at Huntingdon from the fast lines were routed by ARS on the fast lines, not into the relevant platform - sorry can't remember which ones.

9. Cosmetically, the 1l7/8X National Xpress services are shown in the train description as going to Liverpool Lime Street!

10. All the light engine train types are listed as a LD Cl 67 rather than a Cl 66. The LD75 acceleration profile was also listed as Very Low.

I apologise if this is a lot to swallow but this was a very enjoyable timetable.

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Updated Groundhog day TT's 21/10/2017 at 20:56 #102450
Noisynoel
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Updated files sent for approval by a mod.

Everything found has been amended EXCEPT:
6. 3jXX rules need adjusting or implementing to prevent the train re-entering too early after it exits.
These trains can be turned round short of their destination in order to get them back to the depot on time so have been left as is. 3J41 already had rules for this anyway.

8. Noticed that a couple of trains booked to stop at Huntingdon from the fast lines were routed by ARS on the fast lines, not into the relevant platform - sorry can't remember which ones.
The path codes used are those input by NR Planning department. If they are not working correctly under ARS then can you please flag this up with the sim dev

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Updated Groundhog day TT's 23/10/2017 at 09:49 #102465
Giantray
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Several 1Pxx booked to call Huntingdon show FL in Timetable and St Neot's FL too. Two problems, no platform on Fast Lines at Huntingdon, and some of the 1Pxxs have Mainliners overtake them between Huntingdon and St Neot's ( impossible if both are on Fast Lines.)

3J32 arrives early at Biggleswade then sits there for time, in two of my case 30 minutes blocking the Down Slow line.

Using WTT downloaded this morning (23/10/17), not using ARS ( too boring sitting there doing little)

5P64 shows Peterborough Yard SHU on its schedule, but when signalling 5P64 towards the Shunt Line, it comes up with wrong route.

Professional Railwayman since 1981. Railway Historian (SER, LCDR)
Last edited: 23/10/2017 at 09:58 by Giantray
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Updated Groundhog day TT's 23/10/2017 at 11:45 #102467
Noisynoel
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Giantray in post 102465 said:
Several 1Pxx booked to call Huntingdon show FL in Timetable and St Neot's FL too. Two problems, no platform on Fast Lines at Huntingdon, and some of the 1Pxxs have Mainliners overtake them between Huntingdon and St Neot's ( impossible if both are on Fast Lines.)

3J32 arrives early at Biggleswade then sits there for time, in two of my case 30 minutes blocking the Down Slow line.

Using WTT downloaded this morning (23/10/17), not using ARS ( too boring sitting there doing little)

5P64 shows Peterborough Yard SHU on its schedule, but when signalling 5P64 towards the Shunt Line, it comes up with wrong route.
1) see previous post, the details are exactly what NR planners input and the signaller has to deal with on a daily basis.

2) 5P64, I tested this and it works fine for me, I will look at it again and split the train if necessary

Noisynoel
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Updated Groundhog day TT's 23/10/2017 at 12:13 #102469
JamesN
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18250 in the bug tracker for the ARS/Timetable issue at Huntingdon.
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Updated Groundhog day TT's 23/10/2017 at 17:17 #102473
Giantray
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5P64 will not go to the Shunt Line at Peterborough Yard as per the SHU on the schedule because 5P64 is OHL Electric and the Shunt Line is not electrified.
Professional Railwayman since 1981. Railway Historian (SER, LCDR)
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Updated Groundhog day TT's 18/02/2018 at 15:25 #105981
Gwasanaethau
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I just wanted to add that the Acceleration/Brake Rate for the 5/180 train type is set to “very low (slow freight)” when in reality it should be ”high (commuter)”. This is causing all of the Class 180-based services to lose huge amounts of time if they are slowed for whatever reason.

Thoroughly enjoying the timetable, though, so thanks!

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Updated Groundhog day TT's 01/03/2018 at 17:11 #106282
Gwasanaethau
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Also 6H86 has a maximum speed of -1(!)
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Updated Groundhog day TT's 17/07/2018 at 22:09 #110299
ajax103
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I'm currently playing this timetable and have found a bug which I don't think has been covered in this thread as of yet.

5P85 is set to reverse at Connington South Junction however that brings it to a stop at P383 with no means to get to Huntingdon unless it runs wrong road all the way back to Platform 3 at Huntingdon and do a shunt via the Down Fast to Platform 2.

The correct stopping point should be Connington South Junction (Reverse) as the train then stops at P46 in order to turnaround and head back to Huntingdon which is the correct reversing location.

Also not so much a bug but why does 1S04 stop at Peterborough Platform 4 when 1M78 is non stop? They are both mail trains btw.

Edit: Another bug found!

1HO6 is a Hull Trains service and as such is not booked to call at Peterborough even saying it uses Platform DT, this train stops at P423 and the driver questions the route.

Now I've checked the timetable and it's not meant to stop at Peterborough so how come the sim thinks DT is a actual platform?

I've not had this with any other train running non stop though the area, is this a sim bug or a timetable bug?

Last edited: 18/07/2018 at 00:01 by ajax103
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Updated Groundhog day TT's 18/07/2018 at 00:10 #110302
postal
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ajax103 in post 110299 said:
Also not so much a bug but why does 1S04 stop at Peterborough Platform 4 when 1M78 is non stop? They are both mail trains btw.
2009 WTT shows that 1S04 does not stop for traffic purposes so presumably a crew change stop. Incidentally, 1S04 is also shown as a Q path (runs as required) so in normal circumstances would typically only run if there was a problem in the Royal Mail network like perhaps fog causing cancellation of the previous night's Stansted - Newcastle mail flight or problems at one of the Royal Mail road hubs like PRDC or Daventry. However, it would probably run EWD in the Christmas Pressure period in December.

"I drink to make other people seem more interesting." - George Jean Nathan, (14/02/1882 - 08/04/1958), American author, editor, and drama critic
Last edited: 18/07/2018 at 00:11 by postal
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Updated Groundhog day TT's 18/07/2018 at 00:37 #110303
Steamer
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postal in post 110302 said:
ajax103 in post 110299 said:
Also not so much a bug but why does 1S04 stop at Peterborough Platform 4 when 1M78 is non stop? They are both mail trains btw.
2009 WTT shows that 1S04 does not stop for traffic purposes so presumably a crew change stop. Incidentally, 1S04 is also shown as a Q path (runs as required) so in normal circumstances would typically only run if there was a problem in the Royal Mail network like perhaps fog causing cancellation of the previous night's Stansted - Newcastle mail flight or problems at one of the Royal Mail road hubs like PRDC or Daventry. However, it would probably run EWD in the Christmas Pressure period in December.
I wonder if the service ever actually ran in 2009? Low Fell didn't receive a regular service for a number of years until a daily working started in 2013. I'd be inclined to think the path was a strategic spare only.

"Don't stress/ relax/ let life roll off your backs./ Except for death and paying taxes/ everything in life.../ is only for now." (Avenue Q)
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Updated Groundhog day TT's 18/07/2018 at 07:33 #110305
postal
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Steamer in post 110303 said:
I wonder if the service ever actually ran in 2009? Low Fell didn't receive a regular service for a number of years until a daily working started in 2013. I'd be inclined to think the path was a strategic spare only.
Probably right. I'll ask around.

"I drink to make other people seem more interesting." - George Jean Nathan, (14/02/1882 - 08/04/1958), American author, editor, and drama critic
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Updated Groundhog day TT's 23/07/2018 at 10:49 #110377
postal
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postal in post 110305 said:
Steamer in post 110303 said:
I wonder if the service ever actually ran in 2009? Low Fell didn't receive a regular service for a number of years until a daily working started in 2013. I'd be inclined to think the path was a strategic spare only.
Probably right. I'll ask around.
Managed to catch up with a former colleague who was involved with the Royal Mail distribution arrangements at Low Fell RMT. He can't guarantee that his memory is 100% accurate but he cannot recollect any rail operations during the normal run-of-the-mill operation after 2002 until the reinstatement of the PRDC - Low Fell round trip in 2013. There was some discussion in 2009 about using rail during the Christmas pressure period (early December until a couple of days before Christmas) but he can't remember whether it actually happened. Either way, it is unlikely that there were any Royal Mail services on the ECML on Groundhog Day which would rule out both 1M78 and 1S04 as well as any other Low Fell - PRDC Q paths in the TT.

"I drink to make other people seem more interesting." - George Jean Nathan, (14/02/1882 - 08/04/1958), American author, editor, and drama critic
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