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Can I "talk" this train past the red signal.

You are here: Home > Forum > General > General questions, comments, and issues > Can I "talk" this train past the red signal.

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Can I "talk" this train past the red signal. 19/10/2019 at 23:11 #121196
9pN1SEAp
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268 posts
Should we ask for an extra option in the call dialog to "authorise the train to pass signal at danger and call back at the next signal [if at danger]"?

Thanks
Jamie

Jamie S (JAMS)
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Can I "talk" this train past the red signal. 19/10/2019 at 23:33 #121197
JamesN
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If the next signal is at danger the driver should call in anyway, as long as you keep it at danger...
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Can I "talk" this train past the red signal. 20/10/2019 at 01:54 #121198
y10g9
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503 posts
JamesN in post 121197 said:
If the next signal is at danger the driver should call in anyway, as long as you keep it at danger...
The train will phone back at the next signal if its at red, but the 2 minute (or 5 min) timer does restart so they will wait 2 minutes before phoning in again.

9pN1SEAp in post 121196 said:
Should we ask for an extra option in the call dialog to "authorise the train to pass signal at danger and call back at the next signal [if at danger]"?

Thanks
Jamie
There is a request for this on mantis, 27296

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Can I "talk" this train past the red signal. 20/10/2019 at 09:59 #121204
kbarber
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1436 posts
Izzy in post 121181 said:
The quick answer is yes, you can.

If you as a signlman know that you are going to talk a train past, and all conditions are met, there is nothing stopping you from telling the driver to pass at caution etc. For this reason the SPT (signal post telephone) can be rung from the signal box (in most places, but not all). If the train comes to a stand and the phone is ringing, it's a no brainer that the driver needs to talk to the signalman. Even in this day and age :)

This is getting rarer and rarer though, because of CSR, GSM-R etc. A lot of the time the driver will already know what to do, or that he needs to contact the signalman.

But the absolute rule is still that after being detained for 2 minutes, the driver contacts the signalman, end of story. There are just common sense ways to speed it up a bit.

In the exact case you have shown..................it is necessary for the driver to be cautioned past the red signal to a blank signal. So it would be expected that the train is going to stop at the signal in rear. If the signalman is watching the panel closely, he could give it about 2 minutes or so and then start to ring the signal held at danger to save the driver sitting for a couple of minutes first. It may only save a minute or two, but it can all add up. And you can't talk past more than one signal at a time these days - so the quicker you can tell the driver what is happening, the less delay will occur - especially if he knows that he needs to phone up straight away from the blank signal (which doesn't happen in simsig, but nothing is perfect (just close)).

Happy simsigging
The SPTs provided on the WCML with the 1960s resignalling had one-way ringing only. At the signal, there was a knob that the driver had to turn and release; that operated some sort of selector device. In the signalbox was a black cabinet with a stencil display screen. When the selector ran down, the signal number would be illuminated and a buzzer sounded. The signalman picked up the phone, pushed a GPO-type switch one way or t'other (up line and down line signals had separate circuits, and the display was accordingly in two halves IIRC), thus connecting the call. When the conversation ended, the signalman pushed a button to terminate the call and clear down the display. If another driver was also ringing, the display would illuminate again. The signalman had no discretion over which call to answer, and there was no way of calling back.

The system was pretty much standard on LM and Eastern regions. I think I'm right in saying the Southern had something quite different (certainly the L-framed boxes from the 1930s to the mid-50s had a concentrator with a switch for each signal, so the signlman could choose which to answer). I don't know what the Western system looked like.

It was a robust and reliable system and in many places it lasted until displaced by a subsequent major resignalling (that was certainly the case on the North East London network - the area of the West Anglia sim). So I suspect Hademore would never have had a phone with which the signalman could contact the driver. of course, by the end of its life, there was beginning to be radio systems that took over that function and it may be that the old SPTs started to fall out of use, though I believe regular testing by the S&T remained a requirement.

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Can I "talk" this train past the red signal. 22/10/2019 at 04:31 #121250
Giantray
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215 posts
Newer Signalling schemes are having SPTs removed from Signals that are not at Stations. Because of GSM-R and Mobile phones it is deemed unecessary to have every signal with a SPT. They just plate up the signal with the Signal Box telephone number.
Professional Railwayman since 1981. Railway Historian (SER, LCDR)
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Can I "talk" this train past the red signal. 22/10/2019 at 19:16 #121268
pbinnersley
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430 posts
Do they still provide a phone at each location (rather than each signal) in case mobile network/GSMR goes down?
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Can I "talk" this train past the red signal. 22/10/2019 at 19:31 #121269
Stephen Fulcher
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1490 posts
Yes
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