Querying route at failed signals

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Querying route at failed signals 07/09/2023 at 10:38 #153224
Richard Gore
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Online 		Had an encounter today where I had a route set from a signal which was:

1. Wrong, and

2. Set to a failed signal, so it wouldn't clear from red.

I authorised the driver to pass the signal at red, and they queried the route rather than taking it.

First: without an indication on the signal, how would the driver have known that the incorrect route was set at this point? Would they not have only found this out at the first set of points unexpectedly set?

Second: the driver gave me the option to replace the signal and set a different route, however on setting the new route they passed the signal before it had cleared. I would have expected this interaction to have cleared the 'authorised to pass signal at red' flag, no?
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Querying route at failed signals 07/09/2023 at 16:55 #153232
headshot119
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4869 posts 		Richard Gore in post 153224 said:
Had an encounter today where I had a route set from a signal which was:

1. Wrong, and

2. Set to a failed signal, so it wouldn't clear from red.

I authorised the driver to pass the signal at red, and they queried the route rather than taking it.

First: without an indication on the signal, how would the driver have known that the incorrect route was set at this point? Would they not have only found this out at the first set of points unexpectedly set?
In the real world the driver might be able to see the points just ahead of the signal are set for the wrong route, or they might be able to see a nearby signal off in such a way the correct route can't be set from the signal they are stood at, or the signal itself might have a failure of the theatre box / route indicator such that they can see the wrong route is set, but the signal hasn't cleared because of the failure.


Richard Gore in post 153224 said:


Second: the driver gave me the option to replace the signal and set a different route, however on setting the new route they passed the signal before it had cleared. I would have expected this interaction to have cleared the 'authorised to pass signal at red' flag, no?
This does not clear the 'authorised to pass signal at red' flag no.
"Passengers for New Lane, should be seated in the rear coach of the train " - Opinions are my own and not those of my employer
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The following users said thank you: Richard Gore, wulf
Querying route at failed signals 07/09/2023 at 17:36 #153233
Richard Gore
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Online 		Is this "correct" that the flag be not cleared? I don't understand how to safely alter the route in front of the train without somehow revoking the authority to pass the signal.
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Querying route at failed signals 08/09/2023 at 06:29 #153236
DriverCurran
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683 posts 		Richard Gore in post 153224 said:
Had an encounter today where I had a route set from a signal which was:

1. Wrong, and

2. Set to a failed signal, so it wouldn't clear from red.

I authorised the driver to pass the signal at red, and they queried the route rather than taking it.

First: without an indication on the signal, how would the driver have known that the incorrect route was set at this point? Would they not have only found this out at the first set of points unexpectedly set?
When I was still a driver, the signaller, if there was a choice of route, would advise you the route that was set. So having the driver query the route is realistic as you have just told the driver that the route is set for somewhere they are unable to go.

Hope this makes sense at the end of a long night shift

Paul
You have to get a red before you can get any other colour
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The following users said thank you: KCRCRailway, Dionysusnu, jc92, wulf
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