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A little Mock-SimSig Fun!

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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 16/09/2021 at 12:44 #141587
elltrain3
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Nah yeah, it's very useful and I learn plenty of things too!

I'll get Bridgnorth fixed asap!

and yeah the disc on the Stourport line was my mistake! haha got that fixed

Placing Bewdley South's homes was tricky with space so I just tried to squeeze it in where it fits! but don't worry I do know they are on the other side :)

and yeah I'd thought it could be "relief" too but the diagram on the SVR website references it as "Down loop Up" (and thanks it's the biggest I've made so far :P)

and yeah I did some reading on the Arley Token instrument, a strange arrangement whereas you say the box can be worked as a Ground frame for accessing the Yard without opening the box as a block post! and the token machine could "shut-in" trains. an odd arrangement certainly!


I'm aiming to make a steam era mock soon to try and see what kind of size I can do!
as I seem to have covered most of the "big" areas (don't worry AJ Kings X is on the list too still working on that one!) so wanna do some odl fashioned ones before going back to the smaller modern ones!


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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 30/09/2021 at 11:38 #141735
elltrain3
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So Another quick one, with signalling.photos back online I've done a Hastings sim, Covering a total of 4 mechanical boxes,

First Robertsbridge, which is all colourlights these days though a frame still works the local signals all other are done from IFS switches.
Plenty of crossings to handle plus the Gypsum works there.

Next Bo-peep jn! A small box only containing 24 Levers (14 of which are spare) plus 2 IFS panels, One for West Marina C.S. (on the brighton line)
with 1 for the line to Robertsbridge again a small box though very busy in terms of traffic.

Next, the heart of the sim: Hastings! a 4 platform station with BI-DI working throughout plus the very much packed double line to bo-peep (still worked under AB Regs! on the Up at least) then you have plenty of variety with shunts to park sidings as well as southern and southeastern services terminating and heading through to Ore and reversing there. Plus you have the Southern 171s heading through to Rye and onto ashford!

A small sim but wouldn't be quiet!


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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 03/10/2021 at 07:30 #141751
Stephen Fulcher
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elltrain3 in post 141587 said:
Nah yeah, it's very useful and I learn plenty of things too!

I'll get Bridgnorth fixed asap!

and yeah the disc on the Stourport line was my mistake! haha got that fixed

Placing Bewdley South's homes was tricky with space so I just tried to squeeze it in where it fits! but don't worry I do know they are on the other side :)

and yeah I'd thought it could be "relief" too but the diagram on the SVR website references it as "Down loop Up" (and thanks it's the biggest I've made so far :P)

and yeah I did some reading on the Arley Token instrument, a strange arrangement whereas you say the box can be worked as a Ground frame for accessing the Yard without opening the box as a block post! and the token machine could "shut-in" trains. an odd arrangement certainly!


I'm aiming to make a steam era mock soon to try and see what kind of size I can do!
as I seem to have covered most of the "big" areas (don't worry AJ Kings X is on the list too still working on that one!) so wanna do some odl fashioned ones before going back to the smaller modern ones!

Eardington is the wrong way round - the station and siding are on opposite sides of the line to where you’ve drawn them.

Also unless it’s been changed since I worked them ten years ago, there are no track circuits at Highley or Hampton Loade.

Arley had a Down Advanced Starter at the left end of the track circuit towards Highley situated on the right hand side of the line.

Last edited: 03/10/2021 at 07:35 by Stephen Fulcher
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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 03/10/2021 at 19:36 #141761
sunocske
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elltrain3 in post 141587 said:
Nah yeah, it's very useful and I learn plenty of things too!

I'll get Bridgnorth fixed asap!

and yeah the disc on the Stourport line was my mistake! haha got that fixed

Placing Bewdley South's homes was tricky with space so I just tried to squeeze it in where it fits! but don't worry I do know they are on the other side :)

and yeah I'd thought it could be "relief" too but the diagram on the SVR website references it as "Down loop Up" (and thanks it's the biggest I've made so far :P)

and yeah I did some reading on the Arley Token instrument, a strange arrangement whereas you say the box can be worked as a Ground frame for accessing the Yard without opening the box as a block post! and the token machine could "shut-in" trains. an odd arrangement certainly!


I'm aiming to make a steam era mock soon to try and see what kind of size I can do!
as I seem to have covered most of the "big" areas (don't worry AJ Kings X is on the list too still working on that one!) so wanna do some odl fashioned ones before going back to the smaller modern ones!

"Hatley! Hatley! Hatley! Change here for Buston and Wenstead!"

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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 04/10/2021 at 12:21 #141765
elltrain3
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yep, I'll get those fixed, and the TC's at Highley & Hampton Loade were added so you had some idea when a train was waiting/approaching as you say they are not there in real life I've added them to assist in seeing trains where you might be able to in the real box.

Stephen Fulcher in post 141751 said:
elltrain3 in post 141587 said:
Nah yeah, it's very useful and I learn plenty of things too!

I'll get Bridgnorth fixed asap!

and yeah the disc on the Stourport line was my mistake! haha got that fixed

Placing Bewdley South's homes was tricky with space so I just tried to squeeze it in where it fits! but don't worry I do know they are on the other side :)

and yeah I'd thought it could be "relief" too but the diagram on the SVR website references it as "Down loop Up" (and thanks it's the biggest I've made so far :P)

and yeah I did some reading on the Arley Token instrument, a strange arrangement whereas you say the box can be worked as a Ground frame for accessing the Yard without opening the box as a block post! and the token machine could "shut-in" trains. an odd arrangement certainly!


I'm aiming to make a steam era mock soon to try and see what kind of size I can do!
as I seem to have covered most of the "big" areas (don't worry AJ Kings X is on the list too still working on that one!) so wanna do some odl fashioned ones before going back to the smaller modern ones!

Eardington is the wrong way round - the station and siding are on opposite sides of the line to where you’ve drawn them.

Also unless it’s been changed since I worked them ten years ago, there are no track circuits at Highley or Hampton Loade.

Arley had a Down Advanced Starter at the left end of the track circuit towards Highley situated on the right hand side of the line.

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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 04/10/2021 at 13:22 #141766
ajax103
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I've got one question about the signalling at Arley, approaching the station from Highley it appears that the main and the loop in the station are bi directional however while it's obvious for trains coming from Bewdley North to see which one they're being signalled into - there doesn't appear to be the same for trains coming from the Highley direction so my question is how do the drivers know the route is set into the loop or the main?

Shouldn't there be two main semaphone aspects on the signal just before Arley from the Highley direction together with the shunt signal for the yard or as I remember it a small dock siding.

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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 04/10/2021 at 13:25 #141767
jc92
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ajax103 in post 141766 said:
I've got one question about the signalling at Arley, approaching the station from Highley it appears that the main and the loop in the station are bi directional however while it's obvious for trains coming from Bewdley North to see which one they're being signalled into - there doesn't appear to be the same for trains coming from the Highley direction so my question is how do the drivers know the route is set into the loop or the main?

Shouldn't there be two main semaphone aspects on the signal just before Arley from the Highley direction together with the shunt signal for the yard or as I remember it a small dock siding.
24 signal only reads onto the main. The loop isn't bidirectional, only the main, hence a signal arm, plus a disc for the yard.

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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 04/10/2021 at 16:20 #141768
ajax103
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jc92 in post 141767 said:
ajax103 in post 141766 said:
I've got one question about the signalling at Arley, approaching the station from Highley it appears that the main and the loop in the station are bi directional however while it's obvious for trains coming from Bewdley North to see which one they're being signalled into - there doesn't appear to be the same for trains coming from the Highley direction so my question is how do the drivers know the route is set into the loop or the main?

Shouldn't there be two main semaphone aspects on the signal just before Arley from the Highley direction together with the shunt signal for the yard or as I remember it a small dock siding.
24 signal only reads onto the main. The loop isn't bidirectional, only the main, hence a signal arm, plus a disc for the yard.
In that case, the mock sim needs correcting as it shows both the Main and the Loop as being bidirectional. Thank you for clarifying tho.

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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 07/10/2021 at 19:57 #141787
elltrain3
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So 2 Mocks today, First, an updated SVR with all changes made!





Second, a new fresh one for Reading PSB, modelled in 2009 prior to any re-signalling work and for a relatively small sim, it would be busy with freight & passenger alike! with bi-di some really long T.C.s and theale yard it'd make an interesting sim!
Plus the Henley Branch is included!
I've also not included platforms 4a & 4b despite them being worked from the panel for the latter part of its working life, as they are included on the Feltham sim so I've simply made the area a glorified T.D. to include the layout despite it not being controlled.


I may make a "modern" version of reading in the future, based after the takeover to the TVSC and with all its 15 platforms and new CS though would be a challenge to make as it's so much more complex!

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Last edited: 07/10/2021 at 20:01 by elltrain3
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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 07/10/2021 at 20:06 #141788
elltrain3
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I also wondered if somone could tell me what Theale G.F. works? it wasn't evident from the panel and i've not found much luck with photos of it!

So
1. what did it control?
2. did it survive the resignalling? or was it lost and made into hand points?

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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 07/10/2021 at 21:30 #141790
DaveHarries
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elltrain3 in post 141787 said:
Second, a new fresh one for Reading PSB, modelled in 2009 prior to any re-signalling work and for a relatively small sim, it would be busy with freight & passenger alike! with bi-di some really long T.C.s and theale yard it'd make an interesting sim!
Plus the Henley Branch is included!

I remember hearing that a Reading sim was in development but that was a few years back. I have heard nothing on that for a considerable time but it would be good if it came to fruition. Should it do so I wonder if Platforms 4A/4B will vanish from the Feltham sim and be replaced by an entry point.

Dave

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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 07/10/2021 at 21:38 #141791
elltrain3
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Was there? interesting and go for it if you wish! use mine as a template!

yeah I did wonder if Feltham would be edited, but figured simulation wise it's simpler to have the SWR/T services inclusive to Feltham for ease should they need turning back etc and helps get a a full idea where the SWR/T trains are!

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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 07/10/2021 at 21:49 #141792
broodje
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DaveHarries in post 141790 said:

I remember hearing that a Reading sim was in development but that was a few years back. I have heard nothing on that for a considerable time but it would be good if it came to fruition. Should it do so I wonder if Platforms 4A/4B will vanish from the Feltham sim and be replaced by an entry point.

Dave
A few years back? hmm, yeah 17 years ago there was a sim in development. I have a feeling starting a new sim from scratch is easier ;).

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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 08/10/2021 at 00:20 #141793
elltrain3
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So i said I'd put 2 new ones up today, well that was sort of a lie as here is a 3RD!

Slough PSB (Not IECC...that comes later )

A solo sim, simply being a 4-track ML with Main & Relief lines
Plenty of branches, with Marlow/Bourne End, the Windsor Shuttle plus the Freight branch at West Drayton
Would be rather a fun little sim for a solo player, very busy and intense but plenty of Auto buttons to help ease the process

Again simulated in it's 2009 state before the re-signalling started for eventual migration into the TVSC


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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 08/10/2021 at 05:07 #141796
JamesN
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elltrain3 in post 141788 said:
I also wondered if somone could tell me what Theale G.F. works? it wasn't evident from the panel and i've not found much luck with photos of it!

So
1. what did it control?
2. did it survive the resignalling? or was it lost and made into hand points?
Photo of Theale "Groundframe" here: https://photos.signalling.org/picture?/23366/category/2565-theale

It controls the connection from Reception #2 into the ARC or BCI sidings (CMC/Cripple on your drawing), and the crossovers between the country ends of #1 Reception and #2 Reception.

On this screenshot of the Newbury desk simulator, the points are labelled 1b/1b, 2 and 3a/3b at the top right of the screen. https://photos.signalling.org/picture?/17458/category/1732-2015_october_simulator

As you can see from the simulator screenshot, it has survived into TVSC days.

***

To the rest of your mockup, it's good; there's a few bits that aren't quite right though.

You've shown some the signals as Autos, which are actually controlled – R881 approaching Aldermaston Up Westbury, R885 between Towney and Ufton Up Westbury, R161 Above Kennet Loop on Up Relief (next to Up Relief Label), and R163 next signal to the right of that.

You've then got signals with auto buttons that didn't have Auto working in real life – none of the signals at Southcote (369/348), Reading West Station (373/375/346), the signals between West Junction and Reading Station (44/47/144/147), on your drawing the 2 signals approaching Reading on the Down Main (36/28), the signal at New Junction that routes to Up Main or towards Spur Junction (57), or the signal on the Down Relief above that (128). The Autos that remain should be WR-style "Group" Autos like the Welsh sims, groups below:

ALDERMASTON
Up Westbury: 881/885
Dn Westbury: 808

THEALE
Up Westbury: 887/895
Dn Westbury: 800/804

SCOURS LANE
Up Relief: 139/141/143
Dn Relief: 148
Up Main: 41/43
Dn Main: 48

SPUR JUNCTION (although you have off-simmed this bit)
Up Southern: 385
Dn Southern: 326/330

KENNET
Up Relief: 159/161/163
Dn Relief: 122/124/126

HENLEY BRANCH
300/301/306/307

TWYFORD WEST/TWYFORD
Up Relief: 169/171/173
Dn Relief: 110/112/114/116
Up Main: 69
Dn Main: 16

RUSCOMBE
Up Relief: 179/181
Dn Relief: 106
Up Main: 79
Dn Main: 6

I think you're missing a couple of Auto Signals:- DW37 on the Down Westbury after the crossover country end of Reading West, and DW39 on the Down Westbury after Southcote Junction.

UR30B (the green-onto-red Auto Signal at Ruscombe, Up Relief), is a split distant; like R41 at Pangbourne but flipped: https://photos.signalling.org/picture?/10840/category/994-ruscombe

R36 is missing its call-on, it should also have a red override roundel to enable the call-on (like some of the shunt overrides you see in other sims)

Triangle Sidings, wierdly, should only have an exit arrow for the "Out" line; the "In" line is long out of use in the "era" you've mocked up. It also has a slot https://photos.signalling.org/picture?/9666/category/810-2010_may_theale_area_removed

Similarly there should only be one exit arrow for the Engine Line, and 1 exit signal – the point between the two lines was a spring point.

Obviously it's a compromise because you've gone with Feltham retaining control of the Southern, but there isn't a slot towards Spur Junction. On a historical note; that has always been controlled from Reading Panel; since the stations were amalgamated in the 1960s.

Platform 6 the platform should be on both sides like 7 is.

That's all I can find for now, but I have to go to work!

***

As to Reading sim in development – as Broodje alludes to it would be easier from scratch, unfortunately. There was a very old sim that was tried to be brought up to modern/loader standards; but there was too much "wrong" with it from present-day accuracy standards. I then started a new Reading sim from scratch a couple of years ago but in short I wasn't able to devote enough of my time to it; so development was ceased. Perhaps one day someone else can lift the Reading sim curse!

I'll take a look at the Slough mock up when I get home...

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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 08/10/2021 at 09:27 #141797
elltrain3
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JamesN in post 141796 said:
elltrain3 in post 141788 said:
I also wondered if somone could tell me what Theale G.F. works? it wasn't evident from the panel and i've not found much luck with photos of it!

So
1. what did it control?
2. did it survive the resignalling? or was it lost and made into hand points?
Photo of Theale "Groundframe" here: https://photos.signalling.org/picture?/23366/category/2565-theale

It controls the connection from Reception #2 into the ARC or BCI sidings (CMC/Cripple on your drawing), and the crossovers between the country ends of #1 Reception and #2 Reception.

On this screenshot of the Newbury desk simulator, the points are labelled 1b/1b, 2 and 3a/3b at the top right of the screen. https://photos.signalling.org/picture?/17458/category/1732-2015_october_simulator

As you can see from the simulator screenshot, it has survived into TVSC days.

***

To the rest of your mockup, it's good; there's a few bits that aren't quite right though.

You've shown some the signals as Autos, which are actually controlled – R881 approaching Aldermaston Up Westbury, R885 between Towney and Ufton Up Westbury, R161 Above Kennet Loop on Up Relief (next to Up Relief Label), and R163 next signal to the right of that.

You've then got signals with auto buttons that didn't have Auto working in real life – none of the signals at Southcote (369/348), Reading West Station (373/375/346), the signals between West Junction and Reading Station (44/47/144/147), on your drawing the 2 signals approaching Reading on the Down Main (36/28), the signal at New Junction that routes to Up Main or towards Spur Junction (57), or the signal on the Down Relief above that (128). The Autos that remain should be WR-style "Group" Autos like the Welsh sims, groups below:

ALDERMASTON
Up Westbury: 881/885
Dn Westbury: 808

THEALE
Up Westbury: 887/895
Dn Westbury: 800/804

SCOURS LANE
Up Relief: 139/141/143
Dn Relief: 148
Up Main: 41/43
Dn Main: 48

SPUR JUNCTION (although you have off-simmed this bit)
Up Southern: 385
Dn Southern: 326/330

KENNET
Up Relief: 159/161/163
Dn Relief: 122/124/126

HENLEY BRANCH
300/301/306/307

TWYFORD WEST/TWYFORD
Up Relief: 169/171/173
Dn Relief: 110/112/114/116
Up Main: 69
Dn Main: 16

RUSCOMBE
Up Relief: 179/181
Dn Relief: 106
Up Main: 79
Dn Main: 6

I think you're missing a couple of Auto Signals:- DW37 on the Down Westbury after the crossover country end of Reading West, and DW39 on the Down Westbury after Southcote Junction.

UR30B (the green-onto-red Auto Signal at Ruscombe, Up Relief), is a split distant; like R41 at Pangbourne but flipped: https://photos.signalling.org/picture?/10840/category/994-ruscombe

R36 is missing its call-on, it should also have a red override roundel to enable the call-on (like some of the shunt overrides you see in other sims)

Triangle Sidings, wierdly, should only have an exit arrow for the "Out" line; the "In" line is long out of use in the "era" you've mocked up. It also has a slot https://photos.signalling.org/picture?/9666/category/810-2010_may_theale_area_removed

Similarly there should only be one exit arrow for the Engine Line, and 1 exit signal – the point between the two lines was a spring point.

Obviously it's a compromise because you've gone with Feltham retaining control of the Southern, but there isn't a slot towards Spur Junction. On a historical note; that has always been controlled from Reading Panel; since the stations were amalgamated in the 1960s.

Platform 6 the platform should be on both sides like 7 is.

That's all I can find for now, but I have to go to work!

***

As to Reading sim in development – as Broodje alludes to it would be easier from scratch, unfortunately. There was a very old sim that was tried to be brought up to modern/loader standards; but there was too much "wrong" with it from present-day accuracy standards. I then started a new Reading sim from scratch a couple of years ago but in short I wasn't able to devote enough of my time to it; so development was ceased. Perhaps one day someone else can lift the Reading sim curse!

I'll take a look at the Slough mock up when I get home...
Thanks for the notes, looks like I have some editing to do!
I'll get those fixed and then re-uploaded

I found from photos of the panel I couldn’t see Autos and some signals seemed to only have a red arrow for a main route, no sub so certain bits we’re guessing work!

"The Out-of-control Host"
Last edited: 08/10/2021 at 10:18 by elltrain3
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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 08/10/2021 at 10:24 #141801
elltrain3
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JamesN in post 141796 said:
[quote=elltrain3;post=141788]

I'll take a look at the Slough mock up when I get home...
Well, You'll find the same problem with Autos! I'll see if I can find numbers and fix them before you return!

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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 08/10/2021 at 11:00 #141802
elltrain3
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Reading PSB (Updated)


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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 08/10/2021 at 13:43 #141803
Dionysusnu
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elltrain3 in post 141793 said:
So i said I'd put 2 new ones up today, well that was sort of a lie as here is a 3RD!

Slough PSB (Not IECC...that comes later )

A solo sim, simply being a 4-track ML with Main & Relief lines
Plenty of branches, with Marlow/Bourne End, the Windsor Shuttle plus the Freight branch at West Drayton
Would be rather a fun little sim for a solo player, very busy and intense but plenty of Auto buttons to help ease the process

Again simulated in it's 2009 state before the re-signalling started for eventual migration into the TVSC


West Drayton GF is spelled as "West Drayon"

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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 08/10/2021 at 13:58 #141804
elltrain3
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Cheers! haha i'll get that fixed
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Last edited: 08/10/2021 at 13:58 by elltrain3
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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 09/10/2021 at 00:55 #141806
elltrain3
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So here we go, after a full day of squinting and problem solving, here is a proper SLough Panel (hopefully) free of major errors, all Autos simulated as they were on the real Panel!

I've also already made a start on a Slough IECC and it's rather dense and busy! i'll say that much :P


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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 09/10/2021 at 02:04 #141807
Hap
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Good work Eliot.

Your mock ups are really very well presented. I can't think of any presentation that I have made where I have had to proof check more the half a dozen times, and still somethings slip by, We're only human. haha. Keep your passion for this and enjoy it. I'm thoroughly impressed with your drawings as are many others within the community. You'll always get some nit picking, at least you're producing. ;-) Keep it up dude.

Craig

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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 09/10/2021 at 09:45 #141808
elltrain3
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Hap in post 141807 said:
Good work Eliot.

Your mock ups are really very well presented. I can't think of any presentation that I have made where I have had to proof check more the half a dozen times, and still somethings slip by, We're only human. haha. Keep your passion for this and enjoy it. I'm thoroughly impressed with your drawings as are many others within the community. You'll always get some nit picking, at least you're producing. ;-) Keep it up dude.

Craig
Thanks Craig! yeah I do proof check a lot xD but I want these mocks to be as true to simsig/real life as is possible to help visualise areas that are not in simsig yet, and hey i'm learning plenty about the areas I make from the constructive criticism so keep it coming it helps me make better mocks!
Slough IECC is proving to be a headache presentation-wise haha but thank you!

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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 09/10/2021 at 14:24 #141810
ajax103
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Guess Paddington PSB is next or whatever was fringing to Slough PSB before Slough IECC came about?
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A little Mock-SimSig Fun! 09/10/2021 at 15:31 #141811
elltrain3
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Yeah Slough IECC is the one I'm doing initially, but prior to that, I think it was Old Oak Common PSB and after some research, I found that Old Oak had 2 panels, one for the shed(s) and one for the Mainline! The original opened in 1962 though the panel was later replaced in 1967, and the entire panel finally closed in 1995 , with control passing to Slough IECC which itself closed only 16 years later in 2011 control passing to the TVSC which survives to this day.
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Last edited: 09/10/2021 at 15:39 by elltrain3
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