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Warrington Summer 1992 TT

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 24/03/2024 at 17:08 #155816
bugsy
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Just for everyone's information, I had to LEFT click the reset button in order to get it to start flashing.. Nothing happened when I right clicked it. Right clicking it when it stopped flashing was the correct procedure 😀
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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 24/03/2024 at 19:32 #155822
traindriver17
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I must purchase Warrington sim next so i can get to grips with the wonderful looking 1992 timetable!
Just need to continue with York N&S 1991 timetable first

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 25/03/2024 at 12:02 #155828
flabberdacks
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May I please ask about 9T15 / T.15-D11 from Arpley across to Crosfields Siding - it enters at signal 213, but I would have expected it to enter via the hole and go directly in via signal 212.

I'm not sure how to get it from Arpley 213 signal straight into Crosfields without adding some shunting moves to its table. Any ideas?

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 25/03/2024 at 12:27 #155829
bugsy
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traindriver17 in post 155822 said:
I must purchase Warrington sim next so i can get to grips with the wonderful looking 1992 timetable!
Just need to continue with York N&S 1991 timetable first
Yes, you must purchase the Warrington sim. The 1992 timetable by Pascal is excellent and I say this even though I've only got as far as 03:30 and have made numerous mistakes. In fact so many that I've set my auto save to every 5 minutes!

Another of Pascal's excellent timetable is his 1991 West Yorkshire one 😀

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 25/03/2024 at 12:30 #155830
bugsy
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flabberdacks in post 155828 said:
May I please ask about 9T15 / T.15-D11 from Arpley across to Crosfields Siding - it enters at signal 213, but I would have expected it to enter via the hole and go directly in via signal 212.

I'm not sure how to get it from Arpley 213 signal straight into Crosfields without adding some shunting moves to its table. Any ideas?
If I remember correctly, you get an option to send the train via the hole.

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 25/03/2024 at 12:37 #155831
58050
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flabberdacks in post 155828 said:
May I please ask about 9T15 / T.15-D11 from Arpley across to Crosfields Siding - it enters at signal 213, but I would have expected it to enter via the hole and go directly in via signal 212.

I'm not sure how to get it from Arpley 213 signal straight into Crosfields without adding some shunting moves to its table. Any ideas?
On some of the shunt moves from Arpley Sdgs on the phone messgae you get an option as to which signal the train actually enters & the options are above one another on the list & I suspected you clicked on the wrong option. I made that mistake once before by clicking the wrong entry signal for T.15 to go to Dallam Sdgs & it entered via 212. I suspected you clicked on enter train at 213 as opposed to entering train at 212. Users need to be very careful with those pilot trips & select the correct entry signal.

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 25/03/2024 at 20:25 #155835
swiftaw
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58050 in post 155831 said:
flabberdacks in post 155828 said:
May I please ask about 9T15 / T.15-D11 from Arpley across to Crosfields Siding - it enters at signal 213, but I would have expected it to enter via the hole and go directly in via signal 212.

I'm not sure how to get it from Arpley 213 signal straight into Crosfields without adding some shunting moves to its table. Any ideas?
On some of the shunt moves from Arpley Sdgs on the phone messgae you get an option as to which signal the train actually enters & the options are above one another on the list & I suspected you clicked on the wrong option. I made that mistake once before by clicking the wrong entry signal for T.15 to go to Dallam Sdgs & it entered via 212. I suspected you clicked on enter train at 213 as opposed to entering train at 212. Users need to be very careful with those pilot trips & select the correct entry signal.
Yep, have totally made that mistake before.

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 26/03/2024 at 05:01 #155840
flabberdacks
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Ah yes that's probably what I've done. Cheers.

Another thing, 6L34 / 6L3408302 has entered and has the exact same timings at Acton Grange Jn/Runcorn East/Frodsham Jn as the 7D06 / 7D061012-B which I already have on sim. I've got no problem regulating it, it's fun, but normally these kind of things are on decisions or run on different days. I am on a Wednesday.

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 26/03/2024 at 09:40 #155841
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flabberdacks in post 155840 said:
Ah yes that's probably what I've done. Cheers.

Another thing, 6L34 / 6L3408302 has entered and has the exact same timings at Acton Grange Jn/Runcorn East/Frodsham Jn as the 7D06 / 7D061012-B which I already have on sim. I've got no problem regulating it, it's fun, but normally these kind of things are on decisions or run on different days. I am on a Wednesday.
Thanks for spotting this. What I can say about this is that 7D06 is a WTT service, whereas 6L34 is a train taken from the Trip Notice & for these specific Dept'l trains the only thing shown in the trip notice is what I added into the 'notes' on the 'Misc' tab which reads '0800 - 1600 SX Ellesmere Port Departmental Trip.' & that is pretty all you've got to go on. So in reality that train could enter any time & exit any time providing it gets back to Ellesmere Port before 1600. So in effect 7D06 has the correct WTT timings, but as 6L34 is a trip wkg those timings can be ammended. I'll amend the timings of 6L34 for the next tt update.

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 26/03/2024 at 09:43 #155842
slatteryc
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I've noted that trains to Wigan Wallgate won't get a slot unless a TD exists. Can this be added to the manual please ? It took me ages to figure out. I had a train without a TD sitting at Wigan junction and the signal just would not clear.
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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 26/03/2024 at 10:55 #155843
flabberdacks
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slatteryc in post 155842 said:
I've noted that trains to Wigan Wallgate won't get a slot unless a TD exists. Can this be added to the manual please ? It took me ages to figure out. I had a train without a TD sitting at Wigan junction and the signal just would not clear.
It's good because if a non-Wallgate headcode is in, for example something you are meant to bring across to Wigan NW, it won't clear. Ask me how I learned that!

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 26/03/2024 at 12:30 #155845
flabberdacks
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Having trouble with 9T15 / T.15-E2.

It's decided it wants to run the loco around on the main line at Arpley Jn instead of moving into Latchford/MSC sdgs as others all have. Allowed the loco to detach forward into Latchford Sdg expecting it to run down to the neck and back out, but it's turned straight back around behind AJ9 sig and wants to come back onto the front of the train.

Also 6T76 / T.76-C11WFO has entered behind it and is being badly delayed by the shunting ahead.

No chance 9T15 could head into Latchford/MSC to run the loco around like other trains have by any chance?

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 26/03/2024 at 14:09 #155846
bugsy
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Just a quick question.

I've got 0T15 which has just detached from 6T77 and due to head to Arpley Sidings and I've set a route towards Arpley Jn.
I presume that that it is the Loco Sidings at Arpley Jn. because if it was 'Arpley Sidings' at Walton Old Jn. the timetable would include a reverse at signal 222 which is at Walton Old Jn.

Am I correct?
.....


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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 26/03/2024 at 14:22 #155847
slatteryc
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just been caught by a top and tailed detach into Latchford aaarrghhh try and sort that one out ( ps this is hilarious fun and its not even 2am yet )
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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 26/03/2024 at 15:06 #155848
flabberdacks
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bugsy in post 155846 said:
Just a quick question.

I've got 0T15 which has just detached from 6T77 and due to head to Arpley Sidings and I've set a route towards Arpley Jn.
I presume that that it is the Loco Sidings at Arpley Jn. because if it was 'Arpley Sidings' at Walton Old Jn. the timetable would include a reverse at signal 222 which is at Walton Old Jn.

Am I correct?
.....

Nearest access to Arpley Sidings is right there on the right hand side of your screenshot - it's the AJ45 signal entrance which you select from the phonecall list to send a train that way.

Arpley Sidings and Arpley Loco Sidings are two different places. Arpley Loco Sidings is above the Traffic Sidings. Arpley Sidings itself is the bigger one with four ways in

Last edited: 26/03/2024 at 15:07 by flabberdacks
Reason: None given

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 26/03/2024 at 15:14 #155849
58050
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bugsy in post 155846 said:
Just a quick question.

I've got 0T15 which has just detached from 6T77 and due to head to Arpley Sidings and I've set a route towards Arpley Jn.
I presume that that it is the Loco Sidings at Arpley Jn. because if it was 'Arpley Sidings' at Walton Old Jn. the timetable would include a reverse at signal 222 which is at Walton Old Jn.

Am I correct?
.....


No if you egt a train that enters from Fddlers Ferry Power Station with just 34 empty MGR wagons thgis mean 2 wagons have been detached from the train at Fiddlers Ferry Power Station due to the C&W examiner finding defects on them & they have been detached. Arpley Sdgs. pilot T.15 enters the sim via AJ45 signal & goes into the 'Traffic Sdgs.' which is where they do wagon repairs & or maintenance. The pilot will then re-enter to stand behind AJ47 signal. When the associated trip goes into Latchford MSC Sdgs. You then signal t.15 to follow it into the MSC Sdgs at Arpley Jn. The pilot joins the empty wagons & then the shunt engine detaches & goes back to Arpley Sdgs via the route it came in[eg: exits via AJ45 signal] It doesn't run all the way to Walton Old Jn & enter Arpley Sdgs via that route so you need to get the slot so it can go back into Arpley Sdgs via AJ45. This move may occur more than once when you play this TT so be warned. Bugsy in your screengrab you've set the route wrong for 0T15 to go back to Arpley Sdgs.

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 26/03/2024 at 15:25 #155850
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flabberdacks in post 155845 said:
Having trouble with 9T15 / T.15-E2.

It's decided it wants to run the loco around on the main line at Arpley Jn instead of moving into Latchford/MSC sdgs as others all have. Allowed the loco to detach forward into Latchford Sdg expecting it to run down to the neck and back out, but it's turned straight back around behind AJ9 sig and wants to come back onto the front of the train.

Also 6T76 / T.76-C11WFO has entered behind it and is being badly delayed by the shunting ahead.

No chance 9T15 could head into Latchford/MSC to run the loco around like other trains have by any chance?
Like in my previous post I explained that on certain trains wagons get detached at Fiddlers Ferry Power Station on a daily basis due to defects found on those wagons. There is a daily run to Fiddlers Ferry Power Station to collect the defective wagons & bring them back to the Traffic Sdgs for repairs. When this train enters the loco detaches off the wagons between AJ51 & AJ13 signals on the main line. The pilot[0T15] is then signalled into Latchford MSC Sdgs where it will stop & reverse behind AJ16/17 & you then signal it to stop behind AJ 47 where it should then be routed back onto the wagons between AJ51 & AJ13. Once the pilot has joined its wagons it then goes back behind AJ47 & shunts the crippled wagons into the 'Treaffic Sdgs.' Once all that has been done the pilot then comes out of the Traffic Sdgs & IIRC goes back into Arpley Yard via AJ45. Hope this helps. 9T15 does not go into Latchford MSC Sdg. on the Arpley Jn panel.

Last edited: 26/03/2024 at 15:27 by 58050
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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 26/03/2024 at 15:26 #155851
bugsy
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58050 in post 155849 said:
bugsy in post 155846 said:
Just a quick question.

I've got 0T15 which has just detached from 6T77 and due to head to Arpley Sidings and I've set a route towards Arpley Jn.
I presume that that it is the Loco Sidings at Arpley Jn. because if it was 'Arpley Sidings' at Walton Old Jn. the timetable would include a reverse at signal 222 which is at Walton Old Jn.

Am I correct?
.....


No if you egt a train that enters from Fddlers Ferry Power Station with just 34 empty MGR wagons thgis mean 2 wagons have been detached from the train at Fiddlers Ferry Power Station due to the C&W examiner finding defects on them & they have been detached. Arpley Sdgs. pilot T.15 enters the sim via AJ45 signal & goes into the 'Traffic Sdgs.' which is where they do wagon repairs & or maintenance. The pilot will then re-enter to stand behind AJ47 signal. When the associated trip goes into Latchford MSC Sdgs. You then signal t.15 to follow it into the MSC Sdgs at Arpley Jn. The pilot joins the empty wagons & then the shunt engine detaches & goes back to Arpley Sdgs via the route it came in[eg: exits via AJ45 signal] It doesn't run all the way to Walton Old Jn & enter Arpley Sdgs via that route so you need to get the slot so it can go back into Arpley Sdgs via AJ45. This move may occur more than once when you play this TT so be warned. Bugsy in your screengrab you've set the route wrong for 0T15 to go back to Arpley Sdgs.
Oh dear. I forgot where the Arpley sidings actually were. I've sent trains there before so I obviously had a memory failure on this occasion.

Thanks for reminding me. I'll have to cancel the route that I've set incorrectly and suffer the consequences. 😕 And I apologise for all my queries.

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 26/03/2024 at 15:29 #155852
58050
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bugsy in post 155851 said:
58050 in post 155849 said:
bugsy in post 155846 said:
Just a quick question.

I've got 0T15 which has just detached from 6T77 and due to head to Arpley Sidings and I've set a route towards Arpley Jn.
I presume that that it is the Loco Sidings at Arpley Jn. because if it was 'Arpley Sidings' at Walton Old Jn. the timetable would include a reverse at signal 222 which is at Walton Old Jn.

Am I correct?
.....


No if you egt a train that enters from Fddlers Ferry Power Station with just 34 empty MGR wagons thgis mean 2 wagons have been detached from the train at Fiddlers Ferry Power Station due to the C&W examiner finding defects on them & they have been detached. Arpley Sdgs. pilot T.15 enters the sim via AJ45 signal & goes into the 'Traffic Sdgs.' which is where they do wagon repairs & or maintenance. The pilot will then re-enter to stand behind AJ47 signal. When the associated trip goes into Latchford MSC Sdgs. You then signal t.15 to follow it into the MSC Sdgs at Arpley Jn. The pilot joins the empty wagons & then the shunt engine detaches & goes back to Arpley Sdgs via the route it came in[eg: exits via AJ45 signal] It doesn't run all the way to Walton Old Jn & enter Arpley Sdgs via that route so you need to get the slot so it can go back into Arpley Sdgs via AJ45. This move may occur more than once when you play this TT so be warned. Bugsy in your screengrab you've set the route wrong for 0T15 to go back to Arpley Sdgs.
Oh dear. I forgot where the Arpley sidings actually were. I've sent trains there before so I obviously had a memory failure on this occasion.

Thanks for reminding me. I'll have to cancel the route that I've set incorrectly and suffer the consequences. 😕 And I apologise for all my queries.

If this is your first run through I wouldn't worry too much, it's only when you've got used to running this TT & then making silly errors you need to get concerned. When I'm running one of my TTs for thr the 1st time I've made errors so your not alone in that respect.

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 27/03/2024 at 02:40 #155858
flabberdacks
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58050 in post 155850 said:
flabberdacks in post 155845 said:
Having trouble with 9T15 / T.15-E2.

It's decided it wants to run the loco around on the main line at Arpley Jn instead of moving into Latchford/MSC sdgs as others all have. Allowed the loco to detach forward into Latchford Sdg expecting it to run down to the neck and back out, but it's turned straight back around behind AJ9 sig and wants to come back onto the front of the train.

Also 6T76 / T.76-C11WFO has entered behind it and is being badly delayed by the shunting ahead.

No chance 9T15 could head into Latchford/MSC to run the loco around like other trains have by any chance?
Like in my previous post I explained that on certain trains wagons get detached at Fiddlers Ferry Power Station on a daily basis due to defects found on those wagons. There is a daily run to Fiddlers Ferry Power Station to collect the defective wagons & bring them back to the Traffic Sdgs for repairs. When this train enters the loco detaches off the wagons between AJ51 & AJ13 signals on the main line. The pilot[0T15] is then signalled into Latchford MSC Sdgs where it will stop & reverse behind AJ16/17 & you then signal it to stop behind AJ 47 where it should then be routed back onto the wagons between AJ51 & AJ13. Once the pilot has joined its wagons it then goes back behind AJ47 & shunts the crippled wagons into the 'Treaffic Sdgs.' Once all that has been done the pilot then comes out of the Traffic Sdgs & IIRC goes back into Arpley Yard via AJ45. Hope this helps. 9T15 does not go into Latchford MSC Sdg. on the Arpley Jn panel.
That makes sense, thanks for the explanation.

The key issue is that when the loco detaches from the front of 9T15, if it's signalled straight forward into Latchford Sdg, it turns around immediately behind the first signal and doesn't put itself in a position where it can be run around (doesn't go all the way to the neck) - the only option is to bring it back onto the front of the train.

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 27/03/2024 at 09:47 #155860
58050
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flabberdacks in post 155858 said:
58050 in post 155850 said:
flabberdacks in post 155845 said:
Having trouble with 9T15 / T.15-E2.

It's decided it wants to run the loco around on the main line at Arpley Jn instead of moving into Latchford/MSC sdgs as others all have. Allowed the loco to detach forward into Latchford Sdg expecting it to run down to the neck and back out, but it's turned straight back around behind AJ9 sig and wants to come back onto the front of the train.

Also 6T76 / T.76-C11WFO has entered behind it and is being badly delayed by the shunting ahead.

No chance 9T15 could head into Latchford/MSC to run the loco around like other trains have by any chance?
Like in my previous post I explained that on certain trains wagons get detached at Fiddlers Ferry Power Station on a daily basis due to defects found on those wagons. There is a daily run to Fiddlers Ferry Power Station to collect the defective wagons & bring them back to the Traffic Sdgs for repairs. When this train enters the loco detaches off the wagons between AJ51 & AJ13 signals on the main line. The pilot[0T15] is then signalled into Latchford MSC Sdgs where it will stop & reverse behind AJ16/17 & you then signal it to stop behind AJ 47 where it should then be routed back onto the wagons between AJ51 & AJ13. Once the pilot has joined its wagons it then goes back behind AJ47 & shunts the crippled wagons into the 'Treaffic Sdgs.' Once all that has been done the pilot then comes out of the Traffic Sdgs & IIRC goes back into Arpley Yard via AJ45. Hope this helps. 9T15 does not go into Latchford MSC Sdg. on the Arpley Jn panel.
That makes sense, thanks for the explanation.

The key issue is that when the loco detaches from the front of 9T15, if it's signalled straight forward into Latchford Sdg, it turns around immediately behind the first signal and doesn't put itself in a position where it can be run around (doesn't go all the way to the neck) - the only option is to bring it back onto the front of the train.
Yeah users MUST send the loco to the Latchford MSC Sdgs. on the Arpley Jn. panel for the loco to RR its train. Doing it any other way it won't work. in other words follow the TT data for the train. Those who tested the TT along with other users who have completed a run through of the TT will testify the same. Obviously it's an easy mistake to do as there are 2 sets of sdgs. there.

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 27/03/2024 at 11:50 #155861
flabberdacks
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Yep, no worries. All makes sense - operating within the limitations of the sim. Cheers again.
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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 27/03/2024 at 12:59 #155862
sunocske
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What I've learnt in the first place about Pascal's lovely timetables are always read the timetable for every single train or movement. Fail to do this, the result is unpredictable
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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 27/03/2024 at 13:46 #155863
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sunocske in post 155862 said:
What I've learnt in the first place about Pascal's lovely timetables are always read the timetable for every single train or movement. Fail to do this, the result is unpredictable :)
I couldn't put it better myself. Looking at what some of the users running this TT have posted to me anyway it's clearly obvious that they haven't read the specific TT data & have just assumed or guessed where the movement should go. Yeah OK the TTs I write are quite complex not because I want to do them like that, but back in BR days movements occurred which no longer happen in todays railway. I don't really want to put users off, but a couple of TTs I'm currently working on [Crewe summer 1988 & Doncaster station summer 1991] are more complex than this Warrington one. Given time users who play it will get familiar with the movements & the whole TT won't look so difficult. It's probably more difficult for me to be honest as I've never completed a single day with Warrington, furthest I'ever got is between 19.00 & 20.00 & yes I also make mistakes, but as I prefer writing timetables than actually playing them these days & they take a long time to write & sort out prior to release if I was to run through the whole thing I'd probably end up releasing less timetables than I do at present.

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Warrington Summer 1992 TT 27/03/2024 at 14:15 #155864
bugsy
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sunocske in post 155862 said:
What I've learnt in the first place about Pascal's lovely timetables are always read the timetable for every single train or movement. Fail to do this, the result is unpredictable :)
This is oh so true, as I've learnt from many c**k ups 😑

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